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Topic: Another RC related post-Need advice

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Subject: Another RC related post-Need advice
Date Posted: 3/11/2011 12:27 PM ET
Member Since: 6/23/2008
Posts: 14
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I'm a first time poster, but a long time PBS user.  I love this site!  I have been burned many times and so have put RC's in place.  My RC is a bit long, but has grown over time as I have been burned.  Iknow RC's are a tricky thing and many people have been burned by them and so they don't deal with them.  

What I do is intially request a book with my RC's.  If it comes back that it doesn't meet my conditions and the user includes the reason, I may then re request the book without conditions, or if what they say is not that big of a deal, I will tell them to send it anyways.  

Recently I submitted a request and someone turn it down because they assumed I hit the rwap button and was using the site to get credits.  I send out about 30-40 books amonth and so have plenty of credits.  When I am let down, I consider whether or not to hit rwap and most often decided not to.  I may have hit it maybe 4-5 times in the past year.  But that was when the person had not followed PBS rules and the book was unpostable.  I try to be as polite as possible because I know the person has spent time and money sending me their book.  There have been many times when I have been unhappy but have not hit rwap and just donated the books to my library for their book sale or given it away to friends who don't mind if a book has been crayoned in or part of the cover is missing because someone applied tape directly to it, etc.

The user stated that their books fit my RC's but still would not send them unless I submitted my request with my RC's.  I had sent them a PM stating that as long as the book was not an ex-library book for an abridged version that came free with the magazine to please send it.  They in return told me it was against PBS rules to message soemone before a swap, which I had not.  One of the books I had requested was the only copy availble on PBS, which is why I sent that PM.  I really wanted that book.

So in my return PM, I told her I was not misuing PBS and not expecting new books, just books in good conditions and how I had been burned before.  I told her I had so many conditions to avoid hitting rwap.  I also said that if her books fit my requirements, why was she afraid to mail them?  I have not had many problems before with my RC.  Yes peopel have turned them down before for being too long, or having them, but that's okay.  That is their perogative and I respect that.

In response I got that I should not contact her again and to stop harassing her.  They also mentioned this forum and how 50% of the posts were about picky RCs and mine might have been rejected for wanting new books.  I just went through all the posts and thankfully did not find my RC but found a bunch that were unreasonable and shocked me.  And that since I had questioned them, "I was protesting too much." I would like to know if I was in the wrong and being unreasonable.  

I have included my RC's and would like any input.  I will admit I went back yesterday and revised My RC and added the first paragraph.  I know this has nothing to do with anything, but i am a God fearing person and believe in karma.  I must say that my feelings are hurt and will now resort to buying this book, which is something I was hoping to avoid.  I would appreciate any input would like for you to be honest.  My feelings have already been hurt, so complete honesty would be appreciated.  Thank you!

 

 

I may seem extremely picky or expecting new books, but I am not.  At one point or another I have received books that would not be accepted at a charity thrift store or even if you gave it away for free, with one or more of the below.  I am just expecting books to be in good condition.  I would also like to mention all of these are in place so I DON'T hit received with a problem, which I rarely do.  If you are offended or hurt, I apologize.  

I am not willing to accept books that: 1.Have tears on their covers or any other part of the book, 2.Excessive spine creasing, creasing of the covers.  3.Books chewed on by pets 4.Writing anywhere on or in the book  5.Smell like smoke 6.Do not send any books in which you have glued the book and the spine back together. 7.  Skewed spines. 8. Any sort of water/liquid damage.  9.NO EX-LIBRARY BOOKS!!! 10. Abridged books that came free as a promotion with a magazine.  11.  If the book has a remainder mark, please let  me know before mailing the book.  If in doubt please message me and let me know and I will clear up any doubts.  Thank you.

 

 

 

Date Posted: 3/11/2011 12:46 PM ET
Member Since: 1/20/2007
Posts: 1,898
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I wouldn't accept your RC. Here's why:

2.Excessive spine creasing, creasing of the covers. - what's "excessive" to you? I can't possibly know.
5.Smell like smoke - there is no smoking in my house, but I do have sinus issues so my sense of smell isn't perfect. What if it doesn't smell like smoke to me, but does to you? Again, subjective
7.  Skewed spines - I don't know what this means
10. Abridged books that came free as a promotion with a magazine. - wouldn't these have different ISBNs? I actually got burned on this a few years ago - the woman believed that the book I sent "wasn't long enough". It was the complete book, the only version, and matched the selection she made, but I returned her credit because I didn't know any differently. It's the requestor's responsibility to know what they're requesting.
11.  If the book has a remainder mark, please let  me know before mailing the book. - I'm not going to accept a book and then PM and wait for a response. I'd rather let the book sit on my shelf.

Your RCs are polite and I think they're fine as far as that goes. I just think they're too subjective for me to be comfortable mailing a book.

Hope that helps!

Date Posted: 3/11/2011 12:52 PM ET
Member Since: 8/16/2007
Posts: 15,185
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A couple things to keep in mind:

  1.  the next person sending to you is not the last person that sent something bad to you, offended you, or turned you down. Don't start out with a lecture to not do what the last person did because people don't like the assumption that that they are going to do something wrong or getting chewed out for something they haven't done yet. Write your RC from the perspective that you assume the sender is as honest as you are.
  2.  many people hate being asked to PM you. Make up you mind if you want remainder marks or not and put that in there. Don't ask someone to PM you so you can decide each time. People won't they will just deny your request every time.

What's excessive? Don't use terms that may mean different things to different people.

#3, #4, #5, #8 are all part of the site guidelines so they don't need to be restated. It does help avoid getting them sometimes but when you already have an extremely long RC it will only add to the look of pickiness and getting turned down.

With that many things in your RC, I really am surprised you'd get many books. I always try to meet RCs, but paperbacks being swapped once or twice wouldn't meet your RCs because they are pretty strict and almost all HCs I get have remainder marks so I can't see many making it. I think you really have to look at what it important to you and what makes it worth not getting a book. Is a remainder mark really not worth getting a book? A tilted spine? Anything that isn't worth missing out on a book, get rid of it.



Last Edited on: 3/11/11 12:54 PM ET - Total times edited: 1
Date Posted: 3/11/2011 1:23 PM ET
Member Since: 8/15/2007
Posts: 3,044
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I would only keep the no ex-library books and the not currently in a smoking home conditions. Maybe the creased covers if it really bothers you, but I'd just say no creases instead of making it subjective by saying no excessive creases.

The rest are in the rules or don't make sense (what's a skewed spine?). 

I'm curious, why no remainder marks? That does seem picky, IMO, because it's just a simple black dot or line on the bottom of the book. So many books have them anymore what with the large bargain sections in bookstores.

Date Posted: 3/11/2011 1:33 PM ET
Member Since: 7/28/2006
Posts: 4,978
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You really want your RC to be as consise as you can possibly make it.  At the same time, you also want to be as clear as possible too, so it's a bit of a balancing act. 

So here's my thoughts on the whole thing:

If you want to keep it the way it is now with all your conditions, you may want to consider putting line breaks in to break it up a bit.  Some people will see the two blocks of paragraphs and deny right away without even reading it. 

As Melanie stated above, some of your conditions are reiterating site rules.  You may want to consider removing them, since people can be touchy about restating postability rules (for whatever reason). 

Instead of "smell like smoke" perhaps state from a non-smoking household.  Of course, you will still get turn downs for that for people who have gotten the book used and don't know it's history.  Personally, my RC states "no books currently in a smoking household" so that's another idea that makes it less subjective. 

And regarding the remainder mark thing... perhaps say no remainder marks and then if it's a book you don't mind having the remainder mark with  you can turn off your RCs before you request it.  But if you want to keep it the way it is and ask for people to PM you, you need to provide a link to your profile so they can PM you without having to accept your conditions first.  That way after they have contacted you and you decide you don't want the book they can deny your RC and still remain in their place in line rather than accepting the conditions, PMing you, and then having to cancel the request. 

Sorry to hear you've had such trouble.  RWAPs are never fun. 

 

Date Posted: 3/11/2011 1:44 PM ET
Member Since: 1/17/2009
Posts: 9,664
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So, I have to ask, are most of these conditions due to receiving a single book with that issue? I order between 30 and 40 books a month (about 800 since I have joined PBS) and I have NEVER received books with some of the issues that you mention. Like this one .... "10. Abridged books that came free as a promotion with a magazine" .... I've never received one. Are you sure that this is so common that you need to mention it in your RCs?

As to damaged books in general, the most common damage that I receive is some form of mild water damage. All your other conditions ... sure you might get a single book or perhaps two with any one of those issues ... but you have to decide if having the RC is worth the many declines that you probably get.

I would revise your RCs like this, if it were me:

I may seem extremely picky or expecting new books, but I am not.  At one point or another I have received books that would not be accepted at a charity thrift store or even if you gave it away for free, with one or more of the below.  I am just expecting books to be in good condition.  I would also like to mention all of these are in place so I DON'T hit received with a problem, which I rarely do.  If you are offended or hurt, I apologize.   [NONE of this is needed]

I am not willing to accept books that: 1.Have tears on their covers or any other part of the book [pages are covered in the PBS rules], 2.Excessive spine creasing, creasing of the covers.  3.Books chewed on by pets [covered in the PBS rules]  4.Writing anywhere on or in the book  5.Smell like smoke 6.Do not send any books in which you have glued the book and the spine back together. [too uncommon to mention] 7.  Skewed spines. 8. Any sort of water/liquid damage. [covered in the PBS rules] 9.NO EX-LIBRARY BOOKS!!! 10. Abridged books that came free as a promotion with a magazine.  [too uncommon to mention] 11.  If the book has a remainder mark, please let  me know before mailing the book. [you need to decide if you care about this and either have it in your RC or don't]  If in doubt please message me and let me know and I will clear up any doubts.  Thank you.

This leaves you with:

Hi! Thanks for reading my conditions. Please do not send books that:

1. are ex-library books, or
2. are from a smoking environment, or
2. have tears or creases on the cover, or
3. have excessive spine creases (explain what this means to you), or
4. have writing anywhere on them, or
5. have skewed spines (explain what this means to you)

If you have any questions about the conditions, please PM me at chanpreet. Thanks very much for considering these!



Last Edited on: 3/11/11 1:51 PM ET - Total times edited: 2
Date Posted: 3/11/2011 1:52 PM ET
Member Since: 8/23/2007
Posts: 26,510
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I wouldn't touch that RC with a 10ft pole. If it came up with a book request I probably wouldn't even read the whole thing.  Have you really received that many bad books? I've received maybe a dozen that I had to mark RWP and have never thought to put an RC up. 

If I declined an RC and the person then PM'd me to send the book anyway, I wouldn't unless they rerequested the book without the RC. That's what it sounds like this person wanted you to do. 

 

Date Posted: 3/11/2011 2:04 PM ET
Member Since: 8/19/2007
Posts: 4,219
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I too would decline any request with these RCs.  Many are too subjective.  However, everyone is entitled to any RC they want.  Good luck.  There are many fine suggestions above for revising your RCs.  Pat

Date Posted: 3/11/2011 2:20 PM ET
Member Since: 6/23/2008
Posts: 14
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Wow that was fast!  I wasn't expecting so many responses so quickly!   I will definitely go back and take out the conditions that are in the PBS guidelines, and yes I have received that many bad books over the years. 

 

I have edited my RC and am now submitting it for further critique.  

 

I am not willing to accept books that: 

1.Have tears on their covers or spines.

2.Creasing of the covers.  

3.Writing anywhere on or in the book . 

4.Books which have separated from their covers or are hanging on to them by a thread 

5. Skewed spines, where the book does not lay flat or leans all the way over to the right.   

6.Ex-library books

7. Abridged books that came free as a promotion with a magazine.  

8. Remainder marks.

If  you have any questions about the conditions, please PM me at chanpreet. Thanks very much for considering these!  Happy reading and thank you!

 

Date Posted: 3/11/2011 2:30 PM ET
Member Since: 12/28/2006
Posts: 14,167
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I'm also unlikely to accept your RC, and probably wouldn't read past the first paragraph to even get to your conditions in the second paragraph.  As a sender, I have a short attention span . . . after two or three sentences I start to loose interest and my hand drifts towards the 'decline' button.

I agree with much of what has been posted, and Sara's suggestion is very readable.  The numbered list quickly catches my eye, and while reading I'm checking off a mental list "yes, yes, yes....send"   



Last Edited on: 3/11/11 2:30 PM ET - Total times edited: 1
Date Posted: 3/11/2011 3:20 PM ET
Member Since: 11/15/2008
Posts: 3,308
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I work with RCs and I definitely would not touch the first one, and I almost certainly would pass on the second one especially if I were posting a WL book, because I wouldn't want a problem.  If I had a brand new heavily posted book, I might take a chance.  It's clearer, and I can do a check list, but unless its a brand new book with no evidence that its ever been opened, that spine condition is going to make me hesitate.  I think I know what you mean, but even fairly new gently read paperbacks do not have perfectly level spines.  Its subtle but if you look at them from the side they tend to skew slightly even the brand new really big ones.  I tend to interpret RCs strictly, so I'd probably click no.

Date Posted: 3/11/2011 3:21 PM ET
Member Since: 9/13/2010
Posts: 47
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Hi~ I try to request all RC's. Even ones with a lot of conditions. Even with your new RC's I think I would have to decline.

 

"5. Skewed spines, where the book does not lay flat or leans all the way over to the right "

 

I still don't understand what you mean by skewed spine. You all ready have no tears on the spine and no books separating from the cover. With the additional requirement of no skewed spine I would start to think you wanted a book that had only been read once or perhaps never opened. At that point I would have to decline unless it was a book that I bought but decided to never open.

 

Date Posted: 3/11/2011 3:37 PM ET
Member Since: 1/17/2009
Posts: 9,664
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I think she means, if you were to set the book on its spine ... it should be flat, with no leaning to one side or the other. (You know how paperbacks can get that C shaped curve in them in the spine?) Or if you look at the book from the bottom edge, when the spine is not skewed, the book is a perfect rectangle .. but if it is skewed, the bottom edge is like a parallelogram?

That is my interpretation of skewed spine. Books are perfectly postable like that ... I think the OP just prefers not to get them.

Sianeka - ,
Date Posted: 3/11/2011 3:38 PM ET
Member Since: 2/8/2007
Posts: 6,630
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I would make clearer your contact information.  Instead of saying "If  you have any questions about the conditions, please PM me at chanpreet." 

My first thought was: Where is chanpreet?   To avoid confusion, I'd say instead, "If you have any questions, please PM me, my nickname here is chanpreet."

Date Posted: 3/11/2011 3:48 PM ET
Member Since: 8/18/2008
Posts: 7,759
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Even with your proposed changes, I would not send you a book with those RCs.  Here are some of my thoughts.

 

I am not willing to accept books that: 

1.Have tears on their covers or spines.  I'm OK with this one, I guess, although I've received very few books this way.

2.Creasing of the covers.  If you are looking for a paperback book, for instance, the likelihood that especially a MMP will have no spine creasing after being read is slim.  Now, I'm one of those rare people who actually take care NOT to crease the book when I read it, but some people just crease the spines while reading whether they mean to or not.  This one RC will eliminate many of the books you get.

3.Writing anywhere on or in the book . I'm OK with this one if that's your wish.

4.Books which have separated from their covers or are hanging on to them by a thread  
Books that are not attached to their cover are not postable, so this is not needed since it's covered by the rules.

5. Skewed spines, where the book does not lay flat or leans all the way over to the right.   More people may be familiar with this as SPINE TILT.  There are degrees of spine tilt, and since that adds subjectivity to this RC, people will most likely not send a book about which they have any doubt.

6.Ex-library books 
This one is fine.

7. Abridged books that came free as a promotion with a magazine.  I don't like this one at all.  Almost any change in a book--large print, abridged, etc. will be issued a different ISBN.  You are the one that orders the book--you should check this information out when ordering--even if it means verifying information with other websites such as Amazon to make sure you are getting the book you want.  This is especially true in cases where the person has listed a book with no ISBN.

8. Remainder marks.  I ask that you reconsider the remainder mark issue.  I have no idea why remainder marks bother you, but you do realize that BRAND NEW books often have remainder marks.  Many of the ones sold through PBS Market are BRAND NEW, but come with remainder marks.

If  you have any questions about the conditions, please PM me at chanpreet. Thanks very much for considering these!  Happy reading and thank you! 
Most people will not want to PM you about the book, since it requires them to accept the offer to get your PM information.  Then, they must cancel the order if it doesn't meet your requirements.  This is a lot to ask someone, and most people are not willing to put in the extra time and effort, especially after reading all that above.

 

To meet every single one of your requirements, the book would have to be brand new or like new.  While we all have the right to put RCs on our requests, I think you are heavily limiting yourself by the ones you have chosen.  If someone chooses not to accept your RC--for whatever reason--I don't like the idea of pursuing someone to contact them again and again about the book they've already said they don't want to send.  Because, let's face it--the fact you have so many RCs, and some of which are subjective, makes any sender want to just go on to the next wisher and not have to deal with all that.  Bypassing you in line also lessens the chance of getting a RWAP as well.

On that topic, you say you have given out 4-5 RWAPs in the past year.  I haven't given out that many in my whole time of being a member.  Most of the books I get are in VG to excellent condition, and rarely ever have a problem.  Maybe I'm lucky, but I don't think my experience is that unusual.  So, yes, from the number of RWAPs you've given combined with the RCs you have, I can see where people could say you are too picky.  Everyone has the right to make RCs here at PBS.  You certainly do as well.  But you need to realize that there is a point in which the narrowing of the field of books you will accept will make it difficult to get any at all.

Good luck to you on whatever you decide to do!

 

 

 

Date Posted: 3/11/2011 3:54 PM ET
Member Since: 7/28/2006
Posts: 4,978
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Looks much better, although still a little long.  Here's an idea that cuts it down a little bit more:

 

Please do not send books that:

1.Have tears or creasing or seperation of cover or spine.

2.Have any writing or remainder marks

3. Skewed spines, meaning the spine should lay flat when placed spine-down on a table

4.Ex-library books

5. Abridged books that came free as a promotion with a magazine.  

If  you have any questions about the conditions, please PM me, my nickname here is chanpreet.

Thanks very much for considering these!  Happy reading and thank you!

Date Posted: 3/11/2011 4:50 PM ET
Member Since: 8/23/2007
Posts: 26,510
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I still wouldn't accept. I'm sorry but 8 seperate items as no-nos just screams picky person to me.  I'd rather wait for the next requestor.  And I don't PM over RCS ever whether a nickname is in there or not and will generally turn down any that even suggest that I PM to clarify (it should be clear already) or to get book aproval.  Because I don't want to hear, after the book was received, that "you" (you being any generic requestor) weren't PM's about this or that.  All the books I post meet the PBS posting guidelines.

Date Posted: 3/11/2011 5:05 PM ET
Member Since: 4/24/2008
Posts: 310
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Add me to the list that would not send to you.  You are too picky and I wouldn't want to take the chance you would rwap me.

Date Posted: 3/11/2011 5:11 PM ET
Member Since: 10/24/2008
Posts: 1,376
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I'm also one who wouldn't accept this RC. I get most of the books that I post from a UBS. This UBS writes the price of the book on the inside page that doesn't have any text, so to me that's considered writing in a book. I also get a lot of books with remainder marks. You have too many conditions for me to read through the entire list. I just like RC's that are short and simple to understand and don't have subjective wordings.

Date Posted: 3/11/2011 5:21 PM ET
Member Since: 8/16/2007
Posts: 15,185
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The new list is cleaner and much better. Whether people believe you to be too picky is not relevent IMO to how you write your RC, what requirments are important to you are. Doesn't do any good to write RCs that make you look less picky if you will get books you don't want and everyone on PBS has a right to want what they want. There is no guarantee you will get it, but you can ask.

You will get turned down a lot I am afraid. So, so many hard covers traded here are remainders. And though many of us have no problems with reading paperbacks without creasing them, some people can't seem to look at a book without causing the spine to crease. It also seems that something in a new method of binding encourages that spine tilt because a greater percentage of the new paperbacks come to me tilted. So even those who don't look at your RC and scream "picky" and run the other way won't be able to meet them and will have to deny them too :(.

Date Posted: 3/11/2011 6:28 PM ET
Member Since: 6/23/2008
Posts: 14
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Thanks every one's input.    I will go back and revise them again.  I didn't know that some people use spine tilt rather than skewed.  So I learned something new.  I only contacted this person once.  I did not contact them again after they asked me not to.   

 Here they are again, revised some more. Please let me know if any are still ambiguous and need more clarification.  Thank you!

 

 

I am not willing to accept books that: 

1.Have tears on covers or spines.

2.Creasing of the covers.  

3.Writing anywhere on or in the book .

4.Slanted spines, where the book is a parallelogram (diamond/rhomboid shape)  

5.Ex-library books

6.Remainder marks

If  you have any questions about the conditions, please PM me at my nickname chanpreet. Thank you for considering these!  Happy reading and thanks once again!

Subject: RC's
Date Posted: 3/11/2011 6:29 PM ET
Member Since: 11/18/2005
Posts: 5,418
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I think your list of RC's  is way too long and I would zone out half way though. Possibly if it was a brnad new book that hadn't been opened, i might send it-that is the only way a paperback would not have creases on the cover.

 

I have been a member here since November 2005 and I have given maybe 2 RWAP. I have gotten brand new looking books. If it aint broke, don't fix it!

Date Posted: 3/11/2011 6:40 PM ET
Member Since: 1/22/2011
Posts: 2,388
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Last Edited on: 3/11/11 7:03 PM ET - Total times edited: 1
Date Posted: 3/11/2011 6:43 PM ET
Member Since: 1/2/2011
Posts: 212
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I would change #4 to slanted or skewed spines and leave out the parallelogram bit. I think that will just confuse people.

This list is a lot better than the one you started with. It's still long, and you may have a lot of declines, but I would send you a book if I felt it met your guidelines. Like a hardcover, or a new or like new paperback book. Most used paperbacks these days are going to have spine creases or spine tilt, so don't be surprised if your RC is still declined frequently.

Date Posted: 3/11/2011 6:51 PM ET
Member Since: 10/6/2005
Posts: 10,696
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I would have a  problem with the no remainder marks. PBS Market, Book Closeouts, many Amazon 3rd party sellers, Bargainbooks.com - all sell  remainder books and you won't even know that is what you are getting until the book arrives. Probably  80% of the newer books on my shelves are remainder copies.  They were still new books when I purchased them.

I know from past conversations here (cookbook lady anyone?) that a lot of people assume that anyone asking for books with no remainder marks are resellers looking for items they can sell on Ebay and Amazon as new. I think that puts people off even though I'm sure it's not usually the case.

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