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Topic: Asking for prayer

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Subject: Asking for prayer
Date Posted: 6/28/2008 2:27 AM ET
Member Since: 1/29/2006
Posts: 41
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I think I've finally been pushed to my limit. Neighbors are constantly drinking, smoking pot, and running around naked. It's been bad, immoral behavior for about a year. It's getting worse though. The cops say a woman having her top off any time any place at any time is legal as of 7 years ago. They build these fires in their backyard, but the police do nothing nor do the fire department. I've witnessed to them, been nice to them, talked to them about the behavior and how it is bothering us to no avail. Tonight finally, the man (in his 20's) finally told me that this is just the way it's going to be. His live in 20 year old drunk girlfriend who says she is a Christian because she said a prayer some time ago (clearly she isn't, but she is a hypocrite and needs to repent) and their friend who dances around the fire naked who is 19 are fine with all this too. When I saw him completely naked on his roof, I said something then and he said "sorry." I didn't say anything when they were having sex on top of the roof even though people could see from every direction. I haven't said anything to them about the drug use, but the smell is bad and the marijuana pipes lay around sometimes. The cops don't seem to care! I don't know what else to do but just "take it." There are 2 or 3 little boys (about ages 6-9) and one teenage boy that live on the other side of them that can see all this, but the police say it's legal for women to be dancing naked in front of them. I'm so very saddened for them, for Christ, and for us. If they die in their sins they will have to pay for their sin in hell. I've been praying for them, but their depravity is getting worse. I know God is sovereign though.

They live only a stone's throw away from our house and we are in constant contact with them. Please pray for wisdom on our part and that God would convict them of sin, righteousness, and judgment on their part. That God would grant them repentance and faith. That the eyes of the children who see the naked girls be shielded and that I would not grow weary. Also that my husband doesn't have to see the naked girls so much. We had friends from church over tonight and the wife told her husband he couldn't go near the window. I find it sad that our company can't even be free to go outside our backyard or look through the windows outside. I can't stop my husband from going outside if he wants to or to get a cup of coffee from our own kitchen where we can see everything. The police said that because men can go around with a shirt off, so can a woman. I asked, "So could I walk around with my shirt off showing everything anytime, anywhere, and in front of anyone?" She said, "yes." It's like we are Mr. and Mrs. Lot in the city that burned... thank you for your prayers.

L. G. (L)
Date Posted: 6/28/2008 5:21 AM ET
Member Since: 9/5/2005
Posts: 12,412
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You might want to stop looking if it bothers you that badly, and mind your own business.  Being naked in ones' own yard isn't against the law.  We swam nude in our pool all the time when we lived in San Jose (fenced yard).  <shrug>  Sounds like fun to me (except for the drinking and drugs around kids part...)

(Edited for a statement that really isn't related to the topic of the OP.)

 

 



Last Edited on: 6/29/08 2:45 AM ET - Total times edited: 2
Date Posted: 6/28/2008 12:29 PM ET
Member Since: 5/7/2006
Posts: 5,295
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Tamara, do you live in Vegas? Dancing naked in my city would go over like a turd in the punchbowl.

If somebody was mowing their lawn nude it would bother me. We have a chain fence and I can do without that visual assault.

If I were a parent, I wouldn't want my kids seeing this. I actually thought it would be exhibitionism or indecent exposure.

I would think, however, if drugs were involved the cops would do something.

I'm sorry, I'm looking at it from a technical standpoint when you are asking for prayers. Everybody has a different moral character about them. I don't do drugs personally, but if I couldn't smell it and it wasn't offered to children I'd figure they'd just be hurting themselves. I've seen drug withdrawals and addictions. They are not pretty.(not with marjuana of course..cocaine, meth, etc) I will pray for them. Prayer never hurts.

Date Posted: 6/29/2008 6:07 PM ET
Member Since: 3/10/2006
Posts: 2,819
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I'd worry less about them repenting via your moralistic code and spend more time figuring out what exactly the town laws are and if you can get the cops involved considering there are drugs involved.

Date Posted: 6/29/2008 10:36 PM ET
Member Since: 6/19/2007
Posts: 5,930
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I agree with Suzanne, although unless the police have probable cause to search the house (not sure if neighbors' complaints count as that) they can't just enter the house and charge the owners with drug use.  Also, possession of bongs doesn't always imply possession of drugs, several of my friends own hookah pipes purchased from stores that sell all that paraphanelia, but don't smoke anything but tobacco.  So in that, your neighbors may or may not be breaking the law.  Also, I assume bonfires or firepits aren't illegal in your area since the cops haven't acted on them, but they are legal in most areas.  Unless the fires are unattended or hazardous I shouldn't think that'd be a problem.

As for the nudity, that's a little trickier, since everyone has they're comfort zone and it is their right to be naked in their own house & yard.  My friends and I skinny dip & sunbathe topless, and our yard has a fence, but we'd never do it when our neighbors were having a BBQ or had their kids playing in the yard.  Is there a neighborhood council or anything that might be able to mediate?  If its bothering your neighbors on the other side of these people's house can they get involved as well?

Your free to pray for them, but I think you'll have more success in easing your frustration if you can tackle the situation through legal mediation.



Last Edited on: 6/29/08 10:40 PM ET - Total times edited: 2
Date Posted: 7/1/2008 1:09 PM ET
Member Since: 6/20/2007
Posts: 4,979
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says she is a Christian because she said a prayer some time ago (clearly she isn't, but she is a hypocrite and needs to repent

Since when do you decide who is a Christian and who isn't?

If they die in their sins they will have to pay for their sin in hell

That may be what you believe, and that is fine.  But many of us do not believe in a punishing God, nor a place called hell or any place where a person would remain in "eternal damnation."

The cops say a woman having her top off any time any place at any time is legal

Society as a whole in your area has deemed that this is OK.  if you don't like it, you are probably a minority, as it was changed recently as per your original post.  If you don't like it, look elsewhere.  It really bugs me when people complain about seeing a woman's breast, for several reasons.  First and foremost, God gave women breasts so that they could nourish their babies with milk.  They were not meant as sexual organs per se, but are intended to provide food for babies.  I don't really get why the sight of a breast is so offensive.  Second, if males are allowed to show their bare chests, to disallow women from doing the same is gender discrimination.

I have a very hard time believing the original post.  I have a hard time believing that Columbus, OH police and FD are ignoring open fires (especially since a close relative of mine used to be very high up the chain of command in the Columbis FD until he relocated to be near family).  I find it hard to believe that the PD are ignoring the use of illicit drugs in the presence of minors or indecent exposure.

If the neighbors are naked in their yard, don't look into their yard.

I have seen Tamara's posts in the GLBTQ forum, which were seen by most posters in that forum as baiting the members there into reading a hateful diatribe on gays and lesbians.  Thus, Tamara has a history of censuring anyone who doesn't believe the way she does and who isn't just like her.  I have no doubt that the original post is a bunch of hooey.

Date Posted: 7/1/2008 2:25 PM ET
Member Since: 9/24/2007
Posts: 156
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She asked for prayers not opinions!  That means if you are not a believer then this post does not apply to you.

Tamara, I have been praying and will continue to pray for you and this whole situation!  God hears and will answer.

Date Posted: 7/1/2008 3:42 PM ET
Member Since: 6/20/2007
Posts: 4,979
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It is a public forum.  Thus, if you or she do not like the answers others have given, feel free to pass them over.  Everyone has a right to post, not just those in agreement with the OP.

Date Posted: 7/1/2008 4:01 PM ET
Member Since: 6/4/2007
Posts: 2,941
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I'll second that, Sheryl.  This isn't the believers-only forum.  If you're going to put something out there you have to realize that anyone can read it and anyone can respond in pretty much any way they'd like so long as it's not rude or abusive.  A differing opinion shouldn't be considered offensive or beyond the realm of discourse.  If a person doesn't want to face the risk of scrutiny then one shouldn't present themselves publicly in the first place.  I find it hard to see the rationale in attempting to restrict access to a thread in a somewhat general forum like this one to a particular belief.  Post not, lest ye get posted to.

Date Posted: 7/1/2008 5:30 PM ET
Member Since: 5/23/2005
Posts: 6,143
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I don't mean to be rude, but here's what doesn't make sense to me.  The OP was clear in her intent.  She was asking for prayers, not opinions on the situation.  What she got from most people was a dressing down and a "here's why you're wrong".  Sure it's an open forum, and not just a believers-only forum, but didn't we just have complaints from atheists/agnostics about Christians coming in and posting things in threads when that's not what the threads were about? 

There was a thread that was clearly not Christian, and when a Christian posted her beliefs there, it was deemed unwanted, unnecessary, and was the catalyst for the "do we need an atheist/agnostic forum" thread.  Now here is a thread that is clearly asking for prayers, pretty clearly Christian, and yet now this is an open forum where anyone should be able to post whatever they want to?  Why doesn't it go both ways?  Yes, there is a Christian forum where she could post for Christian thoughts only, but I do think she should also be able to post here if she wants, and the intent of her OP was pretty darn clear, if you ask me.  

People either need to go with the thought of it being an open forum, and anyone can say what they want, where they want; or it needs to be posts following the intent of the thread.  Otherwise, people who were crying foul about Christians posting Christian beliefs in clearly non-Christian threads don't have a leg to stand on.  You can only cry "Christian priviledge" for so long, until it just starts to look hypocritical.

Date Posted: 7/1/2008 7:18 PM ET
Member Since: 5/7/2006
Posts: 5,295
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Sure it's an open forum, and not just a believers-only forum, but didn't we just have complaints from atheists/agnostics about Christians coming in and posting things in threads when that's not what the threads were about? 

I think this is a great point.

Date Posted: 7/1/2008 8:50 PM ET
Member Since: 6/19/2007
Posts: 5,930
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I think the issue is whether or not a post is relevant to the OT.  In the thread on smudging, Tamara's comment directed the conversation away from the topic.  On this thread, although I myself don't pray, I offered what persepective & advice I could because not that many people had posted.  Maybe that wasn't the kind of response that was asked for, but I didn't think it directed the conversation away from the topic.  So, to me, that's the difference.  If only one type of response was sought, I apologize, although this is an open forum and if one response was desired that should probably have been specified in the OP or the post could have been listed in CBR.

Date Posted: 7/2/2008 12:20 AM ET
Member Since: 6/10/2007
Posts: 10,401
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...asking for prayer might have been a good indication of exactly what kind of thread this is.

Tamara, you have my prayers.

Date Posted: 7/2/2008 12:21 AM ET
Member Since: 6/8/2007
Posts: 6,358
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Also praying for you, Tamara.

L. G. (L)
Date Posted: 7/2/2008 1:44 AM ET
Member Since: 9/5/2005
Posts: 12,412
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Brenda wrote:

but didn't we just have complaints from atheists/agnostics about Christians coming in and posting things in threads when that's not what the threads were about?

No, we had non-Christians complaining about proselytization in threads that had nothing to do with anyone seeking input on their religious choices.  Had the person simply replied about what was posted, it wouldn't have been a problem.  IIRC, other Christians replied to that thread, and in fact, a Christian sent me a pack of smudging sticks as a result of it.

This has nothing to do with Christian Privilege, by the way.  I suggest you research Christian Privilege and get an idea of what it means.

If she only wanted Christian input, she should have marked the header.  That's what most of us do - including other Christians -  when we only want certain input.

 (edited for massive typos.)

 



Last Edited on: 7/2/08 2:02 AM ET - Total times edited: 4
L. G. (L)
Date Posted: 7/2/2008 1:47 AM ET
Member Since: 9/5/2005
Posts: 12,412
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Michelle wrote: ...asking for prayer might have been a good indication of exactly what kind of thread this is.

Tell that to the hundreds of thousands of Hindus, Buddhists and Muslims - not to mention dozens of other faiths -  that pray multiple times daily.  Christians don't have a monopoly on prayer.

 

 

Date Posted: 7/2/2008 2:00 AM ET
Member Since: 6/10/2007
Posts: 10,401
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For Pete's sake, it was a thread asking for PRAYERS. Not opinions. Did you miss the several times that was mentioned thus far?

L. G. (L)
Date Posted: 7/2/2008 2:03 AM ET
Member Since: 9/5/2005
Posts: 12,412
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Michelle, you made a comment about the header indicating it was about PRAYER.  I pointed out that the header did not indicate it was a Christian thread - which is what people are complaining about; that non-Christians replied.



Last Edited on: 7/2/08 2:08 AM ET - Total times edited: 1
L. G. (L)
Date Posted: 7/2/2008 2:06 AM ET
Member Since: 9/5/2005
Posts: 12,412
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For Pete's sake, it was a thread asking for PRAYERS. Not opinions. Did you miss the several times that was mentioned thus far?

Let me re-edit this so it's more clear.  The thread said "asking for prayer" - I usually do click such threads and do lend support to those who have situations that need support.  As do most people.  And most threads like that also are ones where people give advice.  I didn't see this thread as anything different.  It wasn't labeled "asking for prayer from Christians" or any other indication that it was any different from any other thread.  So me, and Shannon, vanessa, and Jim, and others gave advice - like most people usually do.

So now I and others get lambasted for replying because she asked for prayer only?  WTH?  It didn't seem to me that she was asking for prayer only - in fact she went into great detail about the situation, which lead me to believe that she indeed wanted input about the situation beyond prayer.

Then we also get lambasted for replying because we are non-Christians and she's a Christian?  Again - WTH? If she wants a certain subset of the population to reply then she should indicate as such. That's what others do and have done in the past.

 

 

 

 



Last Edited on: 7/2/08 2:23 AM ET - Total times edited: 1
Date Posted: 7/2/2008 2:16 AM ET
Member Since: 6/8/2007
Posts: 6,358
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"Tell that to the hundreds of thousands of Hindus, Buddhists and Muslims - not to mention dozens of other faiths -  that pray multiple times daily.  Christians don't have a monopoly on prayer."

"Michelle, you made a comment about the header indicating it was about PRAYER.  I pointed out that the header did not indicate it was a Christian thread."

Perhaps.  However the original post seemed pretty clear to me that she was asking for "Christian" prayer.  Anyone of another faith that read the OP would have recognized it as well.

I've only seen a few kind posts here.  The rest of you, it would seem, only came in here with the intent to bash.  That's really not cool, IMO.

Date Posted: 7/2/2008 2:19 AM ET
Member Since: 6/8/2007
Posts: 6,358
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Nevermind...not going there as it is not worth it.



Last Edited on: 7/2/08 2:20 AM ET - Total times edited: 1
Date Posted: 7/2/2008 2:20 AM ET
Member Since: 6/8/2007
Posts: 6,358
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Tamara, just come post this in "Christian Book Recommendations"...I'm pretty sure you'll get a different reaction.

L. G. (L)
Date Posted: 7/2/2008 2:28 AM ET
Member Since: 9/5/2005
Posts: 12,412
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Anyone of another faith that read the OP would have recognized it as well.

Well, it's news to me that "Christians only want prayer from other Christians".  In fact, that's the first time I've ever heard it.  And In fact, I know it's not true for all Christians. 

It may seem to you that people only wanted to "bash" but it seems to me that others only wanted to wag their fingers.

 

Date Posted: 7/2/2008 2:39 AM ET
Member Since: 6/8/2007
Posts: 6,358
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"Well, it's news to me that "Christians only want prayer from other Christians". "

That's not what I said at all.  Perhaps you are reading more into my posts than what is there. 

Perhaps I was mistaken about the "bashing"...maybe it was just that the way it was worded was rude.  My mistake.

L. G. (L)
Date Posted: 7/2/2008 2:44 AM ET
Member Since: 9/5/2005
Posts: 12,412
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Ok, you wrote (direct quote) : However the original post seemed pretty clear to me that she was asking for "Christian" prayer.  Anyone of another faith that read the OP would have recognized it as well.

It was not clear to me and in fact, was apparently not clear to a number of other posters.  That's why the headers should be used.

Fair enough?

(ETA:  I think part of the problem may be that we (Christians vs. Non-Christians) speak different languages, when it comes to this stuff...)



Last Edited on: 7/2/08 2:46 AM ET - Total times edited: 2
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