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Topic: An Echo In The Bone! Some discussion spoiler alert! and SKP too!

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Subject: An Echo In The Bone! Some discussion spoiler alert! and SKP too!
Date Posted: 9/22/2009 12:55 PM ET
Member Since: 3/14/2009
Posts: 9,174
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I'm so excited!!!!! 



Last Edited on: 11/25/09 2:18 PM ET - Total times edited: 3
Date Posted: 9/22/2009 4:00 PM ET
Member Since: 1/12/2008
Posts: 1,356
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I'm so jealous! Please please please let us know how it is.....because I KNOW you are going to start it this very minute!!!!!! I would.

Date Posted: 9/22/2009 4:27 PM ET
Member Since: 8/17/2009
Posts: 1,588
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I'm stupid, stupid, stupid. I stopped in at the B&N I walk past on my way to the office, in the Chicago Loop. In the past, they haven't had books out on the first day of release, but I figured I'd check. And they did. No way I could resist. So I paid Chicago's idiotic sales tax, when there's no reason to do so, if I had just waited until I got back home (in another county, with much lower tax. And had I waited just a couple days, I could have used a Border's coupon, too. But no, stupid, stupid me could not walk away from it. Had to have it NOW.
Date Posted: 9/26/2009 7:08 PM ET
Member Since: 1/12/2008
Posts: 1,356
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So, enquiring minds want to know----HOW IS IT?????????

Date Posted: 9/26/2009 7:34 PM ET
Member Since: 3/14/2009
Posts: 9,174
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Colleen;   Well I finished it early Friday morning.  It is as you can imagine a great piece of work, she's a brilliant writer.  I have a few issues but not enough to keep me from saying I'm very glad I read it, was it my favorite in the series? No.   I'm rereading it, but this is normal for me, with certain authors.    I'll be interested to see what everyone else thought especially about how it ended.   What did you think?

Date Posted: 9/26/2009 11:49 PM ET
Member Since: 1/4/2006
Posts: 1,464
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Well,  I finished it just now.

I'm kinda numb, upset, disappointed; feel lost.    

It was wonderful, as all her books are, don't get me wrong; I totally believe these are the best books out there, hands down.  But,  it's just hard to put in into words.

DG is absolutely a genius.  And she stated on her compu-serve forum that she does not know if #8 is the last.  Right now, I'd have to say no way can it be.  She has opened a whole lot , I mean a whole lot, of doors with EITB.

 

I'm so anxious to hear what you all have to say....Come on, speak up !!!

Date Posted: 9/27/2009 12:23 AM ET
Member Since: 3/14/2009
Posts: 9,174
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Hi Karen;

Well like you I am stunned and numb,  I used the word poleaxed.  I just couldn't believe she left it like that!!!!   I certainly hope it won't be 3 years before #8.  I read that the ending was seriously thought out and reworked, and that it was not hurried as I had first thought.

No doubt she is an amazing writer.  I love that we get to know Willie, and I love the new characters.  The implied "french connection" for Claire very interesting.  I don't want to say much, not that I know what to say at all.  I'm rereading it. 

Date Posted: 9/27/2009 7:33 AM ET
Member Since: 3/30/2007
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Karen....I have to agree with some of the feelings here ...I too agree Herself is a genius in writing but... this book left me stunned, lost, a bit ..OOOOH....gotcha...but near the end... I was screaming WHISKY TANGO FOXTROT!!!! What the H*%%!! NOOOOOOOO...two of the characters get together and what was she thinkin'?  and they (the characters) seemed okay with it...Sorry to sound juvenile, but grossed me out...really did..

there was too much Lord John Grey through-out the book...(My opinion)

and the voyages are just painfully long to read......(SIGH)

Who they find in the lurking in the hills near Lallybroch was a wowser!!!

I wish the Willie/Jamie/Claire/LJG had been a little bit more...

The eighth book needs to tie up a lot of loose ends....and fix a few she left hanging...I agree.. 3 years is too long to wait..

I am sure when I see herself on the 29th at her book signing...(I do have a reservation, thank goodness!) I am going to be very interested to hear the questions and or the remarks posed to Ms. Gabaldon....I will have to think of a few myself...and not get overly emotional about it...LOL , ...right....

I am going back to re read it and struggle through the voyages...maybe there is something revelant I have missed....

Date Posted: 9/27/2009 12:25 PM ET
Member Since: 1/4/2006
Posts: 1,464
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I recommend this web site for ALL the DG info you can handle:  CompuServe Subscribe and become a member; the posts show what you've read and what you havn't.  Diana is on ALL the time!!



Last Edited on: 9/27/09 12:26 PM ET - Total times edited: 1
Date Posted: 9/27/2009 12:35 PM ET
Member Since: 8/17/2009
Posts: 1,588
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I finished it 11:30 PM Saturday night.  I've had almost 12 hours to digest it, and I'm still of mixed reactions, but mostly I'm mad at her--at the cliffhangers.  In this book, there are 7 POV being followed in two different centuries: Claire, Jamie, Young Ian, Lord John, and Willie in 1770s, and Brianna and Roger in 1970s.  And the ONLY POV storyline she wrapped up was Young Ian's.  Well done, I liked it a lot.  But all six of the others are left in HUGE cliffhangers.  The 1970s cliff is espeically mean and nasty.  I'm most upset about that one--that's just CRUEL to leave us there.  The cliffhanger in the 1770s is pretty frustrating, too, but I'd be ok with where it left Claire and Willie, if she'd gone a little further into the scene with Lord John and Jamie.  That scene was just too bizarre as is.  Like she wrote that little subplot on a dare--SPOILERS!!!! ---

SPOILERS:

Dare: Write a plot line where Claire and Lord John have sex, and Jamie is OK with it.  I mean COME ON.  Actually, I'm ok with the sex, but I'm NOT at all ok with how it's going with Jamie, and especially with leaving it exactly there in the cliff hanger.  I want to smack her! 

/// END SPOILERS

Other random observations and reactions:

Several Amazon reviewers have said this book was not as engrossing as others, because of too many POV, and thus it was not a problem to put down.  I agree.  I think this is by FAR the longest I've ever taken reading one of this series: Tues evening through Sat evening.  For her other books, it would have been two or three days, max, including an allnighter, or several near all nighters.  Not this one.  Seven points of view spread over two continents and two centuries really was too much jumping around to get totally engrossed and lose all track of time, as with the others.  I'm not saying that she shouldn't have done it -- she needed to expand it to get the British side of the war, and I wholeheartedly approve of that.  The more of the war she can fit in, the more pleased I am.  (American Revolution has always been my favorite historical period.)

Lord John. ~Sigh~  I liked him fine as a reoccuring secondary character seen through other POV.  He was somewhat interesting and certainly useful in that capacity.  But not enough for his own POV and storyline.  I found myself just skimming, checking for dialogue to avoid missing anything critical, and moving on.  And I found references within his POV to events and people from her Lord John series annoying.  Not nearly all the Outlander fans read the Lord John books.  I haven't been interested in him enough to read them, and doubly so now that he has his own POV in Outlander. I don't like his POV--not how she writes it, anyway.  Oh ... and I REALLY disliked his POV with Benjamin Franklin.  Another candidate for a dare scene, IMO. The more I think about it, the more annoyed I am.  A major character meets Franklin, and we get NOTHING of him as a person, just a description of him nude.  How lame!

The 1770s Lallybroch storyline was fabulous.  I love Jamie's and Ian's relationship almost as much as Claire and Jamie's.  I just wish she could have included more of it throughout the series. I laughed out loud several times, and couldn't explain why to my hubby--too complicated; and on other end, I was in tears.  So very well done.

I really like Brianna's children--more than I like Bree and Roger, actually.  I don't think I've seen another writer handle writing small children as well as Diana does.  Just brilliant.  I really like how she is blending the family back into the 20th century.  Although, really, if I were Bree and Roger, I would seriously consider taking them back to the 18th C after the Revolution is over and they're a little bit older--when they're both old enough for discretion when they get there, and old enough to have input into the decision.

I don't see this series wrapping up in one more book, either.  Not that I want her to!  The more, the better.  (But stop with the cliffhangers already.)



Last Edited on: 9/27/09 12:44 PM ET - Total times edited: 2
Date Posted: 9/27/2009 12:50 PM ET
Member Since: 3/14/2009
Posts: 9,174
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Sharla;  I'm with you on the cliff hangers as it pertains to Bree and Roger's story line.  I had a stomach ache for hours after I finished.

I am still digesting it all, going back and forth finding fine points that I missed in the first read.  But oh Lord if you can hear me don't make us wait 2 or 3 years to find out what happens to the children!!!

Karen;   I checked out the web site thanks for the heads up.

Date Posted: 9/29/2009 1:33 PM ET
Member Since: 1/4/2006
Posts: 1,464
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Jerelyn, that site (compu-serve) is where I learned about PBS. I love it there; you think you know all about the books till you go there. Wow.

Date Posted: 10/3/2009 8:54 PM ET
Member Since: 11/11/2005
Posts: 5,238
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I finally finished Echo yesterday!   It took me a full week to read.  Frankly, this was mostly due to the small font size.   Like Claire, my eyes aren't what they used to be - and I'm only 47 LOL.  I can't imagine how Claire made it to her 60's without "spectacles" :).   So I couldn't read any more than 20-30 pages at a time.

Like I said, I finished it yesterday.  But since then I've been a little, well, shell-shocked.    I went to see Diana on Thursday 10/1 at a book signing (at which point I had only read about 650 pages).   She told us then that some people had thought that the series had ended with A Breath of Snow and Ashes because the ending seemed to wrap things up so well.    She warned us that no one would have that problem with Echo.   Boy howdy - she wasn't kidding!   Seriously, I could have done with one less cliff-hanger.  And maybe just a hint at where Roger is now and whether he and Buck made it through OK.  Diana hasn't even started to wrte the next book, so it's going to be a looooong wait until the next one.  (I guess that means it's a good opportunity to re-read the whole series, right?)

Overall, (despite the cliff-hangers) I loved the book and as usual it totally took me away down the rabbit hole.  Some people might think that there was too much time spent on the battles of the Revolutionary War, but I love that time period and so had no problem with that at all.  But I think that the ending of the book got the short stick.  There were soooo many things that happened in the last thirty pages!  I think those pages could have been fleshed out more.  Diana did also say that she had just finished Echo five weeks ago (it went to press three weeks ago), so maybe she just ran out of time to develop the ending?

By the way, am I the only one who gets an "Outlander hangover" after reading a book in the series?    I just get so into the characters and their lives that I feel a little lost after finishing the book and can't even think about starting a different book for at least a few days.   Other really good books have done this to me a certain extent, but the feeling is always worse with the Outlander books.  It's almost like I'm an addict and go through withdrawal afterwards LOL.

P.S.  Karen, Thanks for posting the link to the Compuserve writers forum.    I had planned to search for it, but you just led me right to it :-)



Last Edited on: 10/3/09 9:42 PM ET - Total times edited: 2
Date Posted: 10/3/2009 9:41 PM ET
Member Since: 11/11/2005
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OK - Now that I've posted my original thoughts, here are my responses to some of your thoughts ;).

I see that I wasn't the only one who was a little shell-shocked by the ending.  It's almost hard to believe that it was seriously thought-out and re-written (per Jerelyn's post).  Maybe it was an over-reaction to the aforementioned comments about the ending of ABOSAA?

I'm probably in the minority of Outlander fans on this one, but I really LIKE Lord John and am glad that his story line was so strong in this book.  He is a man of deep, but highly restrained, feelings.  I like the Lord John books (although not nearly as much as the Outlander books), and was also glad to see the storyline from the Lord John books finally tie in with the storyline from the Outlander books in the form of Percy.  The bit with Claire didn't totally surprise me, although Jamie's nonchalant reaction kind-of did.

I agree, the part with Benjamin Franklin didn't appeal to me either.   I know that history tells us that Franklin was "eccentric", but didn't need to see it in print this way.

Maria, I'm eager to hear your thoughts after your book signing.

 

Oh - and I have a few questions for my fellow Outlander readers that I keep forgetting to ask (Spoilers ahead - BIG BIG Spoilers!)

 

 

 

1)  Claire mentions near the end of the book that Brianna had told Lord John "what she and Claire were".   I didn't remember that at all.   Was that somewhere during the time that Brianna was engaged to Lord John in Drums of Autumn?

2)  Do you all think it was necessary for Jamie to tell his son that he was a "stinkin' Papist" at the end?   After thinking it through, I understand that he felt he had to tell him that he was Catholic in order to tell him about his Catholic name.  But why in those words?  It just seemed too abrupt when William was already in shock.



Last Edited on: 10/3/09 9:48 PM ET - Total times edited: 3
Date Posted: 10/4/2009 1:57 AM ET
Member Since: 1/4/2006
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Lynne, I'm so glad you got through it;  what a ride, huh?


For your  first question, people seem to be in agreement on the compuserrve forum that that discussion took place "off screen" if in fact it did take place. LJ believes Clare and Bri are from France, as far as we know in print.

Date Posted: 10/4/2009 2:59 PM ET
Member Since: 3/14/2009
Posts: 9,174
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I just feel that there are to many questions, and I don't think I'm in the mood to wait.   I feel that the book spent way to much time on the events and not enough on the people we all have grown to care about.  I feel that the ending was rushed and that it, at least in my case, dose not entice me to stay tuned for the next exciting episode.   Not enough satisfaction, to bring me back.

ETA  To bring me running back, I'll defintely read the next book but I won't be chomping on the bit to get it.



Last Edited on: 10/6/09 4:58 PM ET - Total times edited: 1
Date Posted: 10/4/2009 9:38 PM ET
Member Since: 8/17/2009
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I was left very dissatisfied with it, too.  And more than a little annoyed.  I will be back, but not with the kind of expectation and "must have NOW" that I did with this book, and the past two. (I found the series between books four and five.)  I will get the book, yes, but I'll probably wait a few weeks for reviews and read all the spoilers, so I know EXACTLY what to expect. 

Date Posted: 10/5/2009 7:50 PM ET
Member Since: 3/14/2009
Posts: 9,174
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This is our own Cathy M/misfit's review of "Echo" excellent http://misfitandmom.livejournal.com/

Date Posted: 10/6/2009 8:02 AM ET
Member Since: 7/15/2008
Posts: 4,035
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Thank you I-F Letty. nice to know someone reads them :)

As my review states, I was very disappointed and I have to wonder where in the h*** the editor was.

Date Posted: 10/6/2009 2:47 PM ET
Member Since: 3/14/2009
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Hi Cathy,  I check your site a few times a week,  information and laughter!  Priceless! 

Date Posted: 10/6/2009 4:50 PM ET
Member Since: 3/30/2007
Posts: 9,653
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Cathy, You said it perfectly!!! I liked your review!

Lynne... I thought her talk was good,(a rehash from her site ...almost verbatim) but in fact it was great hearing it live... The room only held about 200 people if that...and we were packed in there...She read a passage, where Claire sees the men in the water and Jamie's gooseflesh...;)She answered some questions and a lot of comments were made re: Gerald Butler as Jamie,  for a movie, if it ever gets made...She is one smart cookie...her background and how she got started. She was gracious in signing and posing for all the pictures, she is absolutely beautiful! I think she was grateful for a small venue in the morning, because she had to go to VA, to the HUGE Borders bookstore for the evening signing....My camera died as she was signing my two books and I had an "OH EFF ME, I want to die, I am meeting DG and the camera is dead...let me take a vein NOW!!!"moment...But the librarian was nice enough to snap my picture... At least my mouth isn't hangin open....Oh.. and she liked that I did have on my Claire's Ring...

Date Posted: 10/6/2009 7:36 PM ET
Member Since: 7/15/2008
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Always happy to make people laugh, and thanks Maria also for the kind words.  Don't forget to check out the Book Blogger's Shelf of Shame - you'll spot me there on occasion. http://shelfofshame.blogspot.com/

Date Posted: 10/6/2009 11:21 PM ET
Member Since: 8/17/2009
Posts: 1,588
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Lynne, you asked about the "stinking Papist".  Someone on another board did the legwork, but the answer is that it references a conversation between Jamie and Willie when he was six.  Jamie refered to himself as a "stinking Papist" (I'm pretty sure he used the term because of something Willie had heard) and Willie said he wanted to be a stinking Papist, too.  And Jamie baptised him and gave him his Catholic name, James.  And we know from prior Willie POV that he remembers his Catholic name.  Presumably, he'd remember "the stinking Papist" part of it, too, when Jamie said it to him in the same way, and it will help tie together the groom from his childhood, to the man in front of him, who is clearly his biological father.



Last Edited on: 10/6/09 11:23 PM ET - Total times edited: 2
Date Posted: 10/9/2009 11:43 AM ET
Member Since: 10/29/2005
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Well, I have finally been converted! I read "Outlander" about two years ago and thought it was just okay, didn't feel an urge to read the rest of the series. I'd actually found beautiful hardcover editions of the whole series, except for the last 2,  at a library sale, plus the first 2 Lord John books,  and I decided that I would hold on to all of the books even though I wasn't really crazy to read them. Now, I am so glad I didn't post those books!

I started "Voyager" last night and stayed up until 2:30 reading because I could not put it down. I actually decided to try reading "Outlander" again because of the excitement I was seeing in you guys for the newest book. I can't stand missing out on anything, so I decided to try again and I am so glad I did! Now, I am curious about why I didn't love Outlander the first time I tried it. I must have been in a weird mood or something. ;-)

Usually, when I read a long series of books, none of them ever equals the first one for me. I never, ever like any book in a series as much as I liked the first one, but I don't think that is going to be the case here. I liked "Dragonfly in Amber" better than "Outlander" and I already know that I'm going to end up enjoying "Voyager" more than the first two books. I'm really looking forward to reading more!

I have a lot of reading to get done before I catch up with all of you! :-D

Bonnie (LoveNE) - ,
Date Posted: 10/13/2009 3:37 PM ET
Member Since: 2/17/2007
Posts: 5,982
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I am also an unhappy reader! The ending felt rushed and boring. I can't believe that is all the emotion she could muster for Claire believing Jamie dead! Claire would never have slept with John and then proceed to have casual conversation and laughs in bed with him! She would be unable to function for a verra long time! I think she overdid all the suspense and chaos of ALL the characters at the end. Disappointed to say the least.  The first 500 pages were true D.G. and had me feeling like I was catching up with old friends...

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