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Topic: Force feeding

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Subject: Force feeding
Date Posted: 5/3/2008 1:30 AM ET
Member Since: 8/9/2005
Posts: 20,024
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A woman hears from a coworker that feeding her dog castor oil will help get rid of worms. She thought to herself that her dog wouldn’t want to take the castor oil so she held him down and force fed it to him. She continued to do this for days but each day he would fight with her harder and harder. One day the dog knocked the bottle over in his struggle to get away. The woman went to get a towel to clean up the mess grumbling to herself about just trying to help him and it being for his own good. When she came back she found the dog licking the castor oil up. She then realized that if she hadn’t tried to force feed him it would have been easier from the start.

Moral to the story don’t push things onto people that they don’t want. I understand wanting to tell others about religion but there is a time and place and its not when it is unsolicited.

T. -
Date Posted: 5/3/2008 1:58 AM ET
Member Since: 1/21/2007
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That's a great lesson, Chris.  Thanks for posting that.

Date Posted: 5/3/2008 2:14 AM ET
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Your welcome Tammy. Its a story I heard on a churches radio commercial. I thought it was a good one to share.

Date Posted: 5/3/2008 10:30 AM ET
Member Since: 7/31/2007
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But, my question is....even when unsolicited IF you don't offer it how will you know or how will they know they might be interested?  The lady could have and should have offered the dog the castor oil first and he might have taken it on his own, same with religion...you need to at least offer it and if they don't want it at that time fine, leave it alone but, you still need to offer!

Date Posted: 5/3/2008 11:39 AM ET
Member Since: 8/28/2006
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Well, in my case at least...my pentagram is a glaring warning that I won't appreciate it.

 

You know what bothers me...how so many threads degenerate into proselytizing...I like that nice, gentle reminder from the OP..now lets see how many take it to heart!



Last Edited on: 5/3/08 11:50 AM ET - Total times edited: 2
Date Posted: 5/3/2008 12:18 PM ET
Member Since: 6/10/2007
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Chris, this *is* the religion and spirituality forum. When you come in here, you take the chance of seeing stuff about other religions. Everyone takes the same chance. =)

So this sort of *is* the time and place.

This might go a long way in CMT. On second thought, it might erupt in another ugly battle.

Good story, and it's not that I don't agree. I'm just sayin'...religion & spirituality is all-encompassing. It's sort of a chance you take.

ETA: I DON'T agree with shoveling scripture down someone's throat. It's not my style. I find that it reminds me of those preachers that yell from the pulpit. What does it really accomplish?

ETA again: Candice, what pentagram? I don't see one.

 



Last Edited on: 5/3/08 12:21 PM ET - Total times edited: 2
Date Posted: 5/3/2008 1:18 PM ET
Member Since: 8/9/2005
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Well Michelle when your in a thread about a pagan ritual and someone comes in to tell you all about the joys of Jesus that is unsolicited.

Date Posted: 5/3/2008 2:23 PM ET
Member Since: 10/26/2005
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Not all cleansing rituals are pagan.  Never heard of smudging so can' t comment.  You need to extend a bit of grace, imo...it *is* the religion forum.

Flobee -
Date Posted: 5/3/2008 3:34 PM ET
Member Since: 9/28/2006
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Chris, I agree with you about being "force fed" religion, and this has nothing to do with anyone or this site, but when someone tries to proselytze, my back goes up. I am interested in learning about different religions, I find the wiccan discussions on here fascinating, but when someone says it's my way or the highway, my mind tunes out.

Date Posted: 5/3/2008 8:37 PM ET
Member Since: 8/28/2006
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Michelle, I usually wear one...I use at least one Pagan blinkie in my siggy all the time as well...My blinkies that are obviously Pagan are my way of saying that I am not interested in hearing about Jesus/the Bible/whatever..For those who have blinkies off...I have added a line to my siggy that should be viewable by everyone...Michelle's question made me think of that.

 

Well Michelle when your in a thread about a pagan ritual and someone comes in to tell you all about the joys of Jesus that is unsolicited.

 

I totally agree with the above statement, if someone feels the need to proselytize they should start their own thread instead of hijacking others where people are trying to discuss something other than Jesus and/or the bible. Oh, and some warning would be nice so we non-Christians can avoid the thread like the plague if we choose to without having to open it and have our eyes assaulted with bible verses and any other things we might find disturbing/annoying/whatever..

 



Last Edited on: 5/3/08 8:45 PM ET - Total times edited: 2
Date Posted: 5/3/2008 10:22 PM ET
Member Since: 10/26/2005
Posts: 438
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Candice,

I can understand your frustration if someone were PM'img you with sermons about Jesus.  So if your siggy is asking for no Jesus PM's, that's great!  But it is inappropriate for you to expect any thread that you've started, posted on, or *might* read to abide by your preferences.  This is a public forum.   Posting on a topic is not  just for your eyes only. 

I totally agree with the above statement, if someone feels the need to proselytize they should start their own thread instead of hijacking others where people are trying to discuss something other than Jesus and/or the bible.

Did someone ask you to make a decision for Christ?  Then they weren't proselytizing.  Sharing opinions on the Christian religion isn't any more proselytizing than sharing opinions on Buddhism or whatever.  *And* the thread was not Hijacked.  How does one post (as opposed to a tangent conversation between more than one person) equal hijacking?  If you want a "me-too" thread why don't you post it in the header.  No dissenting opinions will be tolerated!

Oh, and some warning would be nice so we non-Christians can avoid the thread like the plague if we choose to without having to open it and have our eyes assaulted with bible verses and any other things we might find disturbing/annoying/whatever..

Good grief!  I don't know how you make it through your day with your money proclaiming something about trusting in God.  Perhaps you should refuse U.S. currency so your sensibilities won't be assaulted.    How do you survive the forums here with Bible verses in people's siggy's?  You are totally entitled to your opinions and to express your opinions but so is everybody else.  And nobody should be required to check your siggy for fear of disturbing, annoying, or whatever-ing you.

 

Date Posted: 5/3/2008 10:46 PM ET
Member Since: 10/26/2005
Posts: 438
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Chris,

I am *really* confused.  I just saw a thread you started in CMT awhile back but then bumped today about the forums being a war zone.  Am I missing something?  Because starting this thread here, chastising Tamara for sharing her opinion on cleansings is hostile.

Am I not interpreting this correctly?  Is this benign?  I seriously apologize for getting my panties in a wad.  But I'm *still* confused.  This whole thread just provokes us vs. them.  How does a lover of all things friendly and peaceful explain it? 

Seriously, I believe you believe in what you're saying.  But I can't reconcile it with the way my brain works.

Date Posted: 5/3/2008 10:47 PM ET
Member Since: 8/28/2006
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When a thread is about a topic that has nothing to do with jesus or whatever and someone pops up with all kinds of bible quotes and "why don't we all just trust jesus" it is proselytizing and it is hijaking a thread..hence the make your own jesus thread.

 

I am very tolerant of others beliefs..I just don't like having them shoved in my face constantly.  I don't like having a conversation interuppted with bible quoting and other nonsense.  My little warning thing was sarcasm (since you didn't pick up on that)... over in CMT certain people want warnings on everything..I figured I would come up with a new thing to warn about...and, the whole siggy thing was in response to Michelle (that was more sarcasm) I never said people had to check it....

I like dissenting opinions, I don't like holier than thou attitudes.  I like sharing ideas, I don't like every conversation turning into 'Jesus loves you blah blah blah' , 'trust in jesus blah blah blah'

I am one of those people who feels that the whole trust in god thing should be taken off our money, we are a country with many different beliefs...having that written on our money is not very inclusive..god should be taken out of the pledge, again it isn't very inclusive to have it in there...I am big on the separation of church and state..

I like looking at people's siggys, after all a signature is not an inturruption to a conversation and as such is not annoying..

 

I don't think it is unreasonable or inappropriate to ask that a thread of a certain subject not be turned into a chance to quote the bible at people who obviously are not having a conversation about the bible or its teachings...I think it is ridiculous to expect that those of us who are annoyed by that should keep putting up with it...You want to quote the bible, start a thread for bible quotes...people can read it and comment on it and it doesn't clog up other threads where people are trying to discuss something....

 

 

 

 

Date Posted: 5/3/2008 10:57 PM ET
Member Since: 8/28/2006
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That thread was started back in the beginning of November, and the forums have been a little crazy lately.... and Tamara wasn't just sharing her opinion..



Last Edited on: 5/3/08 11:00 PM ET - Total times edited: 2
Date Posted: 5/3/2008 11:19 PM ET
Member Since: 6/10/2007
Posts: 10,401
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There's room for everybody here. Tamara probably meant no harm in her comments. The average person wouldn't have a clue what "smudging" was, and what sort of belief system it might be attributed to. I agree, that if you want only one sort of response, you should put that in the subject line. Otherwise, it doesn't hurt to be open to hearing other opinions. =)

Date Posted: 5/3/2008 11:36 PM ET
Member Since: 8/28/2006
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Opinions and bible quotes/preachiness are two different things.  Why should anyone have to ask for a thread to not be hijacked by that? 

Date Posted: 5/3/2008 11:53 PM ET
Member Since: 8/9/2005
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I wasnt chastising anyone really. I dunno maybe the example I chose (because it was the freshest in memory) could be construed as chastisement. I dunno how but I'll concede to it since I dont wanna make a deal out of it. Im not being hostile at all and in fact thats what the point of the thread you mentioned was. People taking things personally that arent meant to be personal.

But since you feel I was chastising by using that example I'll elaborate. In that thread I kindly said not everyone is christian so not everyone is going to just repent. Then she continued with bible verses and telling how Jesus will make your life allllll better. Truthfully I was raised a christian and I didnt find true peace until I realized that I dont have to live my life by some ancient moral code.

Telling people about your religion is great if they ask. But if no one asked then you shouldnt testify. I totally understand the urge to do it. But if it is unsolicited then its often unwelcome. And in a forum for ALL religions you cant expect everyone to want to hear about Jesus. If the thread had asked specifically about Jesus then yeah go ahead and testify but that thread wasnt asking about Jesus it was asking about cleansing rituals.

ETA this is totally not a snarky remark I swear I mean no snark by it but just because its the religion and spirituality forum doesnt mean its all about christianity and chritianity doesnt belong in every thread. Christianity is not the only religion out there.



Last Edited on: 5/3/08 11:55 PM ET - Total times edited: 1
Date Posted: 5/4/2008 12:09 AM ET
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Chris,

This isn't meant to be snarky either: Christianity *is* a person. It's not a part that a person can compartmentalize (yeah, no clue how to spell that one lol) and put away on a shelf for the "right time". There are different ways, though, to show your faith. One last thought: If the only people that Christians ever talked to about Christ were other Christians, how would there be anymore Christians? =)

 

Date Posted: 5/4/2008 12:31 AM ET
Member Since: 8/9/2005
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Im not saying you cant talk to other people about it. Just dont do it if they dont ask.

Date Posted: 5/4/2008 1:13 AM ET
Member Since: 10/26/2005
Posts: 438
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I understand what you're saying Chris to a point and Candice too, though Candice tends towards exagerration. 

Here's my point.  You all seem overly distressed when a Christian viewpoint is expressed...agitated, disgusted, revolted...whatever.  You may be missing that Christians may be equally troubled by hearing pagan viewpoints...agitated, disgusted, revolted...whatever.  We all have our levels.     How rude would it be for me to start a thread about all that digusting pagan nonsense crap.  I just can't stand reading about it.  It makes my skin crawl....and on and on.  Do you agree that would be rude? 

We're sharing a forum.  Not only that, but we're sharing with each other and learning from each other.  I personally think it would be childish to start labeling headers as Wiccan only...no Christians allowed.  It's in the reading and responding to people who are different from us that we learn.  We learn more about ourselves and our fellow PBS'ers.

I think the reason this whole situation frustrates me so much is that it *seems* that Christians are singled out for this type of mocking.   It's like some people have a chip on their shoulder whenever Christian stuff or Bible stuff comes up.  It's more than disagreement.  Disagreement if it's in the mood will engage in a discussion.  Disagreement when it's not in the mood will just ignore it.  This isn't disagreement.  This is anger and frustration and mocking.   

I don't want to censor your frustration.  You're free to share.  I'm free to share to.  So here are my thoughts and I'll shut-up...

Moral to the story don’t push things onto people that they don’t want.  I understand wanting to tell others about religion but there is a time and place and its not when it is unsolicited.

I disagree.  There are times and places to give unsolicited advice, religious or otherwise.  There are times and places to tell people what they don't want to hear.   But apparently we will just have to disagree about when those times and places happen to be :-)

 

Date Posted: 5/4/2008 1:39 AM ET
Member Since: 8/9/2005
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What the eff Im not hostile and Im not distressed and Im not disgusted. (a little miffed that people keep assuming I am though) I didnt once say dont ever talk about christianity if you can find where I did I'll pay you a dollar. Im simply saying that if christianity isnt pertinant to the conversation then dont throw it into the conversation just cause you (narrative not directed at anyone) feel someone is misguided and lost. If your religious viewpoint is pertinant to the conversation then post it. If it isnt then dont. Dont reply to a thread with a puritnical this is the only way to live mentality thats all Im saying. It may be the only way for you to live and thats fine. But its not the only way for all of us to live.

I agree some non christians act as if christianity is a plague but I dont. I have nothing against christianity and if you will go read my origional post I didnt mention christianity at all. I said religion no one should force any religion on anyone be it paganism, islam, judaism christianity or any other religion. It wasnt until Michelle said this entire forum is the time and place to testify that I even mentioned christianity and it was just the freshest example that came to mind. Had there been another that didnt involve christianity fresh in my mind I would have used that as an example. I dont view christianity as an enemy. Its simply another way to live your life.

And sorry this is gonna sound like Im snarking again cause I cant think of a better way to word it. I swear Im not snarking. But its kinda ..... arrogant to think that anyone who didnt ask for it will need to hear about christianity even if they dont want to. I cant honestly think of one example where anyone NEEDS to hear about it. You may think that it would help them but christianity is not the end all be all make the world a better place happy pill. Again what is right for you is not right for everyone. (yous are narrative)

L. G. (L)
Date Posted: 5/4/2008 6:46 AM ET
Member Since: 9/5/2005
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Chris hit the nail on the head with her above post.

There is an entire forum devoted to Christianity.  If I want any advice from Christians, I'll go there.

Rebecca wrote:

It's like some people have a chip on their shoulder whenever Christian stuff or Bible stuff comes up.

Maybe if many of them didn't try to shove their religion down our throats at every turn, the feeling wouldn't exist.  Just a thought. 

There is no problem what-so-ever in participation in the forum, but proselytization crosses the line of what is appropriate and welcomed, AFAIC.  I suspect a lot of other posters feel the same.

And by the way, there has been at least one poster turned away from this forum by the proselytization in my smudging thread.  Good work, Tamara.

 

edited for clarity.



Last Edited on: 5/4/08 7:06 AM ET - Total times edited: 5
Date Posted: 5/4/2008 8:34 AM ET
Member Since: 7/29/2005
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There is no problem what-so-ever in participation in the forum, but proselytization crosses the line of what is appropriate and welcomed, AFAIC.  I suspect a lot of other posters feel the same.

I feel the same way. 

We're sharing a forum.  Not only that, but we're sharing with each other and learning from each other.  I personally think it would be childish to start labeling headers as Wiccan only...no Christians allowed.  It's in the reading and responding to people who are different from us that we learn.  We learn more about ourselves and our fellow PBS'ers

Yes we are a sharing forum, but the Christian viewpoint would be a bit easier for some of us to swallow if it were worded as a viewpoint and not the be-all-end-all of the conversation. 

For example the smudging thread, if some one had said, "I don't smudge but when I feel I need spiritual cleansing I light candles to the Virgin Mary."  That's okay.  Talking about baptism as a cleansing ritual is OKAY, talking about Ash Wednesday as a cleansing day, is OKAY.  BUT coming into the thread and saying "If you accept Jesus you won't need any of that other stuff. "  Is not okay.  Saying  that the reason we are so interested in smudging is because Jesus is missing from our lives is NOT okay, it crosses a line from discussion to sermon and it's really distasteful to some of us. 

edited for spelling



Last Edited on: 5/4/08 8:36 AM ET - Total times edited: 1
Date Posted: 5/4/2008 11:08 AM ET
Member Since: 6/19/2007
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I think the point that gets irritating is when people bring up the 'fact' that believing in Jesus makes your life all better in a discussion that's devoted to learning and exchanging information that's less commonly heard. It's basically a wall, a dead end in the conversation.  Not like L's example of people who burn incense and candles to saints, which would be adding to the conversation, not shutting it off.

I think everyone knows what Christians believe and why they believe it and if they don;t understand something they can always ask (like I did when trying to find out what non-Catholic Christian sects believe in original sin). It's fine that you love your religion and want to share it, but when was the last time a Pagan came to the Christian forum and said "Oh, you must feel so lost if you don't believe in the mother goddess & feel at peace with her" and how would that make you feel?  Sharing religious beliefs and practices is fine if its relevant to the conversation, but saying my beliefs are the be-all, end-all of beliefs is off-putting.

 

Date Posted: 5/4/2008 11:38 AM ET
Member Since: 8/28/2006
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I understand what you're saying Chris to a point and Candice too, though Candice tends towards exagerration. 

HA! Not. I tend towards heavy sarcasm, but I do not exagerate...there is really no need...

 

Here's my point.  You all seem overly distressed when a Christian viewpoint is expressed...agitated, disgusted, revolted...whatever.  You may be missing that Christians may be equally troubled by hearing pagan viewpoints...agitated, disgusted, revolted...whatever.  We all have our levels.     How rude would it be for me to start a thread about all that digusting pagan nonsense crap.  I just can't stand reading about it.  It makes my skin crawl....and on and on.  Do you agree that would be rude?

We are agrravated by having the bible barfed at us constantly...no one has started a thread talking about all that christian 'crap'...I think you are missing the point (and the heavy sarcasm, again) that non-christians DO NOT WANT OTHER PEOPLES RELIGIOUS BELIEFS CONSTANTLY SPEWED AT THEM!  How sad is it that people who would have been interested in learning about other religions have left this forum because people WILL NOT STOP PROSELYTIZING?! THAT disgusts me.  We should be able to discuss things here without worrying that someone is going to come barf their scripture at us...

And, I want to make perfectly clear that it is not the scripture itself that bothers me..it is people shoving it down my throat and their holier than thou attitude while doing it that bothers me and many other people.

 

We're sharing a forum.  Not only that, but we're sharing with each other and learning from each other.  I personally think it would be childish to start labeling headers as Wiccan only...no Christians allowed.  It's in the reading and responding to people who are different from us that we learn.  We learn more about ourselves and our fellow PBS'ers.

Yeah, and how can anyone learn anythinng when a thread gets hijacked by people barfing scripture all over the place.  It drives away people who would have liked to read what the thread was actually about..Kristen summed it up pretty well in her post...

 

I think the reason this whole situation frustrates me so much is that it *seems* that Christians are singled out for this type of mocking.   It's like some people have a chip on their shoulder whenever Christian stuff or Bible stuff comes up.  It's more than disagreement.  Disagreement if it's in the mood will engage in a discussion.  Disagreement when it's not in the mood will just ignore it.  This isn't disagreement.  This is anger and frustration and mocking.   

 

Well, if people would quit shoving their beliefs down our throats there would be no reason for anger and frustration would there...

I don't want to censor your frustration.  You're free to share.  I'm free to share to.  So here are my thoughts and I'll shut-up...

Moral to the story don’t push things onto people that they don’t want.  I understand wanting to tell others about religion but there is a time and place and its not when it is unsolicited.

I disagree.  There are times and places to give unsolicited advice, religious or otherwise.  There are times and places to tell people what they don't want to hear.   But apparently we will just have to disagree about when those times and places happen to be :-)

 

I don't even know what to say to that...

Get off your cross, we need the wood.  (edited to point out this little bit of sarcasm)

:)



Last Edited on: 5/4/08 11:50 AM ET - Total times edited: 1
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