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Topic: So frustrated!

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Subject: So frustrated!
Date Posted: 9/13/2010 2:55 PM ET
Member Since: 1/31/2009
Posts: 133
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I requested a book and then got a message stating that it was accepted so I thought everything was fine.  Then I check my messages a few days later to find that the person who accepted the request sent me a message stating that the book is actually marked up and asking if I still want it.  Then I got a message a couple days ago (I got them all at the same time--a few moments ago), stating that she was cancelling the order since I didn't respond.

First of all, I'm annoyed because I don't feel like I should have to watch my messages for this kind of thing because people should follow the rules and not post unpostable books.    But, more than that is that I didn't get my credit back.  Can anyone give me any advice about what to do?  Does it take a while to get your credit back or what?

Date Posted: 9/13/2010 3:01 PM ET
Member Since: 2/13/2007
Posts: 2,249
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Did you check your credit registry? The PM said that she was going to cancel...that does not mean that she had cancelled yet, but when she does, you should see that reflected in your credit registry. She cancels = credit automatically refunded to you by system.

If you wanted to, you could contact TPTB to alert them to the member knowingly listing books that do not meet postability guidelines, a big no-no.

Date Posted: 9/13/2010 3:05 PM ET
Member Since: 12/28/2006
Posts: 14,167
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*hugs* Crystal.  Sounds like the other member posted the book under PBS 'Textbook' clause, which is legit.  And yes, it states that the sender MUST NOT mail the book without requester approval of the book condition.  Although frustrating for you, the offering member did indeed follow the official guidelines for posting a textbook (highlighted) book.

BUT, your credit should have been returned when the transaction was cancelled.  Have you checked your Credit Registry?  If it's truely not there, you may need to contact TPTB, b/c it should have been automatic with the cancellation (and almost immediate).



Last Edited on: 9/13/10 3:08 PM ET - Total times edited: 2
Date Posted: 9/13/2010 3:10 PM ET
Member Since: 1/31/2009
Posts: 133
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So the protocol is to post anybook in any condition, call it a "textbook" then accept the request and it's the requestor's responsibility to be constantly watching their messages for a week or 2 to make sure that they aren't getting messages that the book is unpostable?  Really? 

I honestly had no idea that this was allowed.  I just thought that after the request was accepted you mailed the book if you were the sender or you could wait for your book to come if you were the requestor.  I don't have very reliable/regular internet access and had no idea that this is something I needed to be worried about.  I thought that after I received a message stating it had been accepted I was good to go.

Date Posted: 9/13/2010 3:14 PM ET
Member Since: 1/31/2009
Posts: 133
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I'm sorry to come across as rude, but I really needed this but since I had credits I decided to check here before ordering elsewhere.  I live in a rural area so I can't just go to a bookstore and buy it, I have to order it.  So, it was frustrating for me to get a message saying that my request had been accepted, and to spend the next week thinking my book was on it's way only to find a belated message stating that she was cancelling my request.

Date Posted: 9/13/2010 3:18 PM ET
Member Since: 12/28/2006
Posts: 14,167
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Generally, that's true Crystal.  The Textbook & Cookbook clauses are the only exceptions.  Here's part of the info from Help Documents:

No writing or highlighting or underlining on text pages

  • a signature or note on the flyleaf or inside front or back cover is OKAY
  • an author's signature on the title page is OKAY
  • writing or highlighting or underlining on the text pages is NOT OKAY
    • AnchorException: if it is a textbook or workbook, these are expected to have highlighting/underlining/writing
      • if you post a textbook/workbook, the condition must be described to the requestor in a Personal Message
      • AND the described condition MUST BE AGREED TO in a reply PM before the book is sent

If the requestor doesn't want the book, or doesn't reply in time, you must cancel.

Therefore, the other member followed the rules.  When she did not hear from you, she cancelled the transaction so you retained your wishlist postion.  The next available copy of the book will be offered to you.

Date Posted: 9/13/2010 3:22 PM ET
Member Since: 12/28/2006
Posts: 14,167
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Bummer Crystal, the time issue definately adds to the frustration factor.  I don't think PBS recommends requesting books when members have time constraints, some requests will time-out and be offered to the next member several times...which takes much longer.

Date Posted: 9/13/2010 3:36 PM ET
Member Since: 1/31/2009
Posts: 133
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Denise, I get that.  the point is that she accepted the request right away, so I had no reason to suspec that there was a problem.  You seem clearly adamant to play the devil's advocate here, but I'm guessing if the roles were reversed you'd be frustrated too.

And, it wasn't even a case of her posting under the "textbook" clause (on purpose anyway).  She said the reason it took her a while to contact me about it is because she got it off her shelf and then realized that there was a lot of highlighting and markings.  My point is that from what I understand of the pbs rules, you should check your books BEFORE posting them, otherwise how can you post them in good conscience if you haven't even looked to see if they are postable or not?  If she were posting under the textbook clause, then I think she should have sent me the message immediately after accepting my request, not days later.

Date Posted: 9/13/2010 3:43 PM ET
Member Since: 1/31/2009
Posts: 133
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And, had I not received a message right away that she had accepted my request, I would have known that I needed to be thinking about other possibilities rather than expecting for this whole week and a half that my book was on its way.  You seem determined to blame ME in some way or another for this other member's irresponsible actions and THAT is even more frustrating than the situation itself!

Date Posted: 9/13/2010 3:56 PM ET
Member Since: 12/28/2006
Posts: 14,167
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All good points Crystal, and yes I would be frustrated also.  But the sytem isn't perfect and members aren't perfect either...therefore TPTB encourages members to be patient.

And yes, the sender should have checked the book before posting it.  But upon realizing she had a problem, it appears she tried to do the right thing given the circumstances. 

I sometimes order Weekend Biographies to donate to our school library.  Apparently, these are frequently used in classrooms and approximately 1/3 arrive on my doorstep with highlighting and/or writing...with no advance warning or approval.  Getting to the point that I almost cringe before opening the package...will it need a RWAP or not?  Given the choices, is it better to cancel the transaction before having a problem, or deal with a problem transaction after the fact?

Date Posted: 9/13/2010 4:09 PM ET
Member Since: 1/31/2009
Posts: 133
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And, it clearly frustrates you to get those books in that way.  So, apparently you get frustrated when other people do things incorrectly as well and maybe you could just back off a bit.  We all need to vent sometimes, and that's what this is.  We'll just have to agree to disagree, because you seem determined that this is somehow all my fault (either because you think I"m not being patient or because you think I apparently didn't allow enough time or whatever the case may be) and that's fine.  I am determined that I did nothing wrong in requesting this book and that I had every right to believe that since she accepted the request stating the book was on it's way, that the book was, indeed, on it's way to me.   No, it's not her fault that I didn't have internet access for a while, but it's not my fault that she didn't check her book prior to posting as PBS requires.  Nor is it my fault that she waited days to look for the book and contact me about it. Nor is it my fault that she chose to cancel the request instead of waiting more than a day or 2 for my response.  This is why I'm frustrated.

Date Posted: 9/13/2010 4:20 PM ET
Member Since: 9/8/2009
Posts: 613
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Crystal, I know you're frustrated, but I certainly don't get the impression that Denise is laying the blame for this at your doorstep!  I think she's just trying to explain how it could have happened.... Not that it was right or wrong.  Deep breath!

It sounds to me like it was probably an honest mistake on the sender's part.  Life does happen.  I recently had egg on my face when a PBS member requested one of my books and it was only when I went to grab it off the shelf that I realized my son had taken it with him when he was home for a visit.  You're right.... It's the sender's responsibility to make sure that books are postable, but things do slip through the cracks.   At least she did send you a message.... How many times have you seen posted here messages where someone received an unpostable book? 

If you had time restrictions, you could have ordered it from Amazon.... but if you don't check your e-mails regularly you might have known that they had backordered it on you, either.  There's no perfect system.

Date Posted: 9/13/2010 4:56 PM ET
Member Since: 8/15/2007
Posts: 3,044
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I don't think Denise is blaming you at all. She's just trying to explain to you how things sometimes happen. I once accepted a request before rechecking the book (yes, I flipped through it before posting) and realizing there was a stain I missed the first time. It happens and I PMed the requestor about it who was actually okay with the stain. No one is trying to disregard the rules or make life hard on other members, but mistakes do happen and we can't expect perfection every time. Luckily you got a sender who did try to make it right. They probably canceled the request after you didn't respond because it was close to timing out. I think canceling with a reason is viewed more positively by the site owners instead of letting a transaction time out.

Date Posted: 9/13/2010 5:01 PM ET
Member Since: 5/25/2009
Posts: 598
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Do you have your account set to email you whenever you get PBS messages? I get a copy of all of mine to my email inbox, so I don't have to constantly check my PBS account. 

Date Posted: 9/13/2010 5:06 PM ET
Member Since: 11/11/2007
Posts: 96
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Crystal,

You vented, and your frustration was acknowledged in every post.

The sender tried to do everything right by contacting you when she realized there was a problem and cancelling when she faced either sending a book that didn't meet the guidelines or getting dinged for not mailing on time.  You tried to do everything right because you saw that it had been accepted, but accepted does not mean mailed.  In the end, nobody got the result they wanted, but that can be the result without it being anyone's fault.

Date Posted: 9/13/2010 5:10 PM ET
Member Since: 1/31/2009
Posts: 133
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Okay, everyone.  I get that things happen.   And, it sounds like you guys all apparently handle things better than me.  Although, I have to say that I'd be willing to bet that you get frustrated sometimes too.  Yes, mistakes happen and yes sometimes we get frustrated when things don't go our way...it works both ways.  I understand that she "tried to make it right" but my problem is that she  waited several days to contact me and then cancelled after only a couple of days after that.  I just wish things had gone differently, and I think if you guys are honest you'll admit that sometimes you get frustrated about things as well. 

But, I did get the credit thing worked out so at least I'm not out that as well.

Date Posted: 9/13/2010 5:16 PM ET
Member Since: 1/31/2009
Posts: 133
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In the end, it really is her fault.  Yes, we all make mistakes, but when you post a book, you are certifying that it is in postable condition.  If you didn't look at it previously then it is  your fault.  Do mistakes happen?  YES, I get that.  I get that it was a mistake, but that doesn't mean it wasn't her fault.  It's fine to disagree at this point.  Everyone has pointed out reasons that it's my fault and here is why I think it's her fault:

1.  She should have looked at the book prior to posting.
2.  She should have contacted me sooner than several days after accepting the request.
3. She should have given me longer than a day and a half to respond before she cancelled the request.

 

Why is it completely understandable to everyone that she took several days (4 in fact) to contact me about the situation, but it's unacceptable that I didn't respond back within the day and a half time that she gave me?  I really don't get it, except that I don't post here often so I'm not in the clique.

Date Posted: 9/13/2010 5:24 PM ET
Member Since: 1/31/2009
Posts: 133
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And, yes, my frustration has been acknowledged, but consistently followed by either what I should have/could have done differently or how the poor pitiful other member is a saint.  Which really doesn't acknowledge my frustration at all, with the exception of Sally who didn't really weigh in on how it was my fault.

I know that no one is being malicious or mean, but it's frustrating to just want to vent for a bit and have someone, anyone, say "yes I can see how that would be frustrating," and instead all I get is a bunch of stuff about how she didn't do anything wrong and that it's really MY bad either because I wasn't able to be contacted quickly enough (forget that she took 4 days to contact me and only allowed me 1 and a half to respond back to her), or because I'm not being understanding enough which isn't even the case.  I GET THAT MISTAKES HAPPEN. 

All I'm saying is that it was frustrating for me and I wish it could have gone differently.  I don't think that's the crime that everyone is making it out to be.  I have no ill will toward this girl and I get that it was an honest mistake and that she felt like she tried to make it right by contacting me.  I just wish it could have gone differently.

Date Posted: 9/13/2010 6:24 PM ET
Member Since: 8/18/2005
Posts: 7,977
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I GET THAT MISTAKES HAPPEN.

But you seem to be totally over reacting to a mistake.

Yes, it's frustrating. Yes it would have been better if she'd noticed the book was messed up before she listed it.

But if she missed it when she posted it, and then left it to mail to the last date she was allowed and noticed it when wrapping, then if she was honest she had no choice but to try to get your permission before her mailing time ran out. She'd have to cancel before her mailing time was up.

If she'd been dishonest, she could have just mailed the book and hoped you didn't notice the marks before making it received.

Everyone has pointed out reasons that it's my fault and here is why I think it's her fault:

No one has said anything was your fault, they've just been trying to help you understand what might have been going on at the other end.

Explaining what can happen is not blaming you at all.

All I'm saying is that it was frustrating for me and I wish it could have gone differently.  I don't think that's the crime that everyone is making it out to be.

No one here is making any of this out to be a crime. It's just something frustrating that happens sometimes, even by well-meaning people who make a mistake and try to do the right thing when they notice the mistake.

I'm sorry you didn't get the book you really wanted, but you might have been even more frustrated to have gotten that book and found it marked up. Sometimes, not getting the book is better. Then you can wait for the copy you really want.

Date Posted: 9/13/2010 7:15 PM ET
Member Since: 7/31/2007
Posts: 2,690
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Ok, yes I'm another one to play devil's advocate here but, there are some things that should be noted...

1)  I'm getting the impression that this was not a book that was on a Wishlist so, you ordered it FIFO....do you realize that this book could have been on her shelf 2,3,6 months or more.  She could have known at the time that it had underlining but, under the Textbook clause it was still legally postable and then once it had been ordered after all the time sitting on her shelf she forgot til she pulled it off the shelf to wrap that it had underlining.

2)  Why did she only allow you 1 1/2 days to respond to her message about whether or not you'd accept the book with underlining.  Well, it could possibly be that was all the time she had left before she HAD to mark the book mailed so, after a day and half she had to cancel the request.

3)  Why did she wait so long to contact you....when I accept a book request I don't always have time right at the moment to go pull the book (besides I'm not always home when I accept the request) and so it may be 2-3 days before I can pull it and wrap it...I don't pull mine til I'm ready to wrap and mail. Maybe your sender is the same way.

4)  I don't think that anyone has Blamed you OR insinuated that the sender was/is a saint.  As was mentioned, explaining what could have happened is not blaming you. 

With PBS you have to learn to roll with the flow...some books take awhile to get to you and some books get there quick.  Books get sent and books get cancelled.  Sorry this happened but, call it a lesson learned...if you have a time table to get the book, PBS is not the place to order the book unless you order months before you NEED it.

Date Posted: 9/13/2010 7:41 PM ET
Member Since: 2/21/2009
Posts: 2,925
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It's possible to inadvertently miss things. I buy books for my shelf frequently...last time it was 87 at once. I look through them when I buy them, and when I post them - but not page by page. I look through them again very carefully before I wrap them to mail. I've found problems on the 3rd look through that I didn't see either of the first two times. It happens. I'm sorry if that causes the proposed receiver a problem or frustration, but I'm not going to send a rwap book - whether it's one day or three days later. Because I make it a practice to mail ASAP, I don't PM, I cancel. 

It's best not to be in a hurry for a book ordered here. If someone waits until the last minute to accept, the last minute to mail, and something goes wrong...or even if the mail is slow - you are talking weeks, not days.

Date Posted: 9/13/2010 7:47 PM ET
Member Since: 6/23/2010
Posts: 148
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Wish there was a way to rate senders and receivers.  I realize that it doesn't work with the FIFO system but after reading these forums it is seems to me that the "old PBS" ran smoother than the current version.  My husband and I have been members since the end of June.  We have received several books in great condition/average used book-acceptable condition and we have both experienced problems with receiving unpostables, a lost sent book and a lost book we ordered-all in 2.5 months.  The culture of "patience" is one thing but the cause ought to be deserving of patience which I am not so sure it always is.  =) Now that I have complained, I will be guilty of some of the things I find maddening about this site. However, I try to treat my mailed books with the same care for which I like - prompt mailing of postable books in protective packaging. 

Crystal, I feel your pain.

Date Posted: 9/13/2010 7:50 PM ET
Member Since: 6/23/2010
Posts: 148
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It's best not to be in a hurry for a book ordered here. If someone waits until the last minute to accept, the last minute to mail, and something goes wrong...or even if the mail is slow - you are talking weeks, not days.

Or in the case of my latest request - wait ~2 months from initial request before it arrives if it arrives.

Date Posted: 9/13/2010 8:19 PM ET
Member Since: 7/31/2007
Posts: 2,690
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Debbie H. 

could I inquire as to what "old PBS" you are referring too?

Date Posted: 9/13/2010 8:50 PM ET
Member Since: 8/18/2005
Posts: 7,977
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  I realize that it doesn't work with the FIFO system but after reading these forums it is seems to me that the "old PBS" ran smoother than the current version.

Yeah, I'm curious too.

The FIFO is the same, and there never has been a rating system for members.

Although the Wish List has changed a bit, it's still basically the same.

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