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Topic: goofed-can I find out if sender previously denied book?

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Subject: goofed-can I find out if sender previously denied book?
Date Posted: 4/20/2010 10:13 AM ET
Member Since: 1/17/2010
Posts: 400
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First, this is my fault, so I will not be refusing the book.  Just confused at the process.

I have a book on auto request.  I also have an RC to not come from a current smoker home, due to allergies and asthma. I saw the book show up as in my list as waiting for sender to accept. 

I figured they were taking the whole time to accept, no problem with that, that is their right.  I was checking my email account (not PBS but Gmail) and saw where the request had been denied due to my RC.  I saw where it had happened again.

You all know the process, it goes back on the wish list and the next person gets a chance to accept or reject.  But if there is only one person with this book they receive the request again.  I think I am right in this.  Correct me if wrong.

My confusion is why aren't we sent a message to our PBS personal mail, instead of to my Gmail, and the transaction mail ?  I only found out when I checked my Gmail, which I do only once a week.  I check in here at PBS quite often, to see what is going on when I have books to send out or I am requesting.  I didn't see anything show up that clued me in to the problem with auto request and my RC

How can I find out if the book is coming from the same sender who rejected it due to not meeting the RC?  If it is the same one it will probably be a book I can't accept, but DEFINITELY WILL NOT   mark as RWAP, as the mistake is mine, not their's. 

Sorry to be such a bother, I searched the help section and the archives here but didn't find anything that was helpful.

Janette

Date Posted: 4/20/2010 10:42 AM ET
Member Since: 8/15/2007
Posts: 3,044
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How is it your fault? And for that matter, how could they ever send it if they've been rejecting the RC?

Unless I missed something and you turned off the RC so that they would accept your request for the book, which means you can't RWAP anyway unless it doesn't meet PBS guidelines.


Anyway, all the emails PBS sends can be found in Club Communications under My Account. So if you're on PBS every day, but not your email, you could check your Club Communications file to make sure everything is running smoothly.

Date Posted: 4/20/2010 10:54 AM ET
Member Since: 8/18/2005
Posts: 7,977
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IIRC your RC won't go to the same person twice. You have to turn off your RC for that book to have it offered to the same person again.

Although I don't know why you'd do so if you really don't want a book from a smoking home. It's not a mistake on your part to have an RC, and not one on theirs to decline if their book doesn't meet conditions.

Sounds like the RC worked like it should.

Here's a link to the RC information, with the part about having to turn off your RC to re-request a book from someone who has already turned down your RC.

http://www.paperbackswap.com/help/search.php?terms=requestor+conditions

  • If a sender declined your request and you still want the book (and that copy is still available):
    • Change your Requestor Conditions - turn them off or adjust the text and click Update
    • Request the book again.
    • If the book was already offered to or requested by another member, you will NOT be able to re-request it, since that copy of the book is no longer available.
Date Posted: 4/20/2010 11:12 AM ET
Member Since: 8/16/2007
Posts: 15,187
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IIRC your RC won't go to the same person twice. You have to turn off your RC for that book to have it offered to the same person again. - This has changed and it can go back to the same sender without any action by the requester. The Help Doc means that you should change the RCs before you manually re-request, but the system will just keep requesting books, even if its a copy already denied for RCs.

 

I am not sure why you would think this is coming from the person that denied your RCs. First - if there were any other wishers, as soon as they denied your request it would have been offered to them. The only way it would circle back is if there were only a few wishers and the sender denied ALL due to RCs or they cancelled and reposted after somone else accepted the offer.  If you were the only wisher, once the RC was denied your wish would have been moved to your Reminder List and your email would have told you that you should wait until their copy of the book is requested by someone else before putting it back on your Wish List.

No matter what, if it cycled back to the same person, they still would need to deny any RCs they cannot meet.

Date Posted: 4/20/2010 11:19 AM ET
Member Since: 1/17/2010
Posts: 400
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somehow I deleted what I was writing to clarify what I am trying to figure out. 

This is the first autorequest I have had, so I am more uncertain of procedures in this area:  If I autorequest a book and there are three people who have it, it goes to the first person.  If they can't send it due to my RC, then it goes to the second person.  Then to the third person.  If there is only one person who has the book, don't they get the request again?  I seem to remember reading here other members talking about the request being sent to the same person.

And, if there is the only one sender, doesn't  it goes back to the sender and wouldn't they assume that I want the book and can ignore the RC?

As for not reading it in the Club communication, I didn't know that was there, stupid of me, but I have checked that out only  once when I first became a member  and didn't even think about checking it, until I went to my Gmail and saw the posts there.

I'm a slow learner, I guess and haven't figured a lot of stuff out.   

I feel it would be my fault for not catching that it was returning to the only sender, and so they are sending me a book that I can't accept, but not their fault.  So, it would be unfair to mark it RWAP, as I normally would if sent a book requested. 

Hope that makes better sense.

Janette

Date Posted: 4/20/2010 11:31 AM ET
Member Since: 8/18/2005
Posts: 7,977
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And, if there is the only one sender, doesn't  it goes back to the sender and wouldn't they assume that I want the book and can ignore the RC?

Why should they assume that? It's too dangerous for them to ignore an RC, because sending a book that doesn't meet an RC is a big black mark, from what I understand.

Doesn't matter how many requsts I got for a book, I would never assume I could ignore an RC even if I knew it was from the same person. And I don't think there is any way to tell who the person is who's asking for your book on an RC. I don't think I can know it's you, and without an email saying you'd take the book and not mark it RWAP anyway, I'd have no proof that I did the right thing.

(Even then, mistakes happen. I had someone who agreed to take a book in a certain condition, then marked it RWAP anyway. After the book had been in the mail for a few weeks, they'd forgotten about our agreement. At least I still had the PM to remind her about it, and she was very appologetic and was able to correct the RWAP.)

I'd never, ever guess and send a book that didn't meet an RC.

I feel it would be my fault for not catching that it was returning to the only sender, and so they are sending me a book that I can't accept, but not their fault.

If they declined, there has been no book sent at all. They don't have an order, so no address to send to.

 

Date Posted: 4/20/2010 11:32 AM ET
Member Since: 1/17/2010
Posts: 400
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Melanie,

Your post came through as I was typing mine. 

I was, from what I could tell, 1 of 1 so I make the assumption that I was the only one, so far, who had requested that book, and I don't remember any other in the system when I requested it.  But others could have been added after I had looked.

I am sure that there are quite a few who have my RC, no book from a current smokers home due to allergies and asthma, but it is highly doubtful that the sender would receive several of them in a row so that it would return to me.

So, from what I am gathering from the responses.  The sender is more than likely a different person. 

I just refuse to RWAP a sender when it isn't their fault; there is enough who get blamed for something that isn't their fault on both sides of the coin.   

Thanks for helping me to better understand the procedures. 

Janette

Date Posted: 4/20/2010 11:35 AM ET
Member Since: 3/4/2007
Posts: 4,546
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I think the situation you're referring to only happens if the requestor cancels the original request.  There are members who get impatient when the person they've requested from takes too long to accept, so they cancel the request, then request the book again.  When you do this, the request will just go back to the same person, because they'll still be the first one in line.  Does that make sense?  With WL books, your request will not go back to the same person, unless you turn off your RCs first. Hope that helps.



Last Edited on: 4/20/10 11:36 AM ET - Total times edited: 2
Date Posted: 4/20/2010 11:50 AM ET
Member Since: 8/23/2007
Posts: 26,510
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It has happened before where people have been caught in a loop where there's 1 copy and only 1 wisher.  I think it's supposed to put teh book on your RL until the denied copy gets ordered. But it doesn't always do that and it just keeps requesting from the same person. So if it keeps happening you might want to contact PBS and see if you are caught in a loop.

Cathy A. (Cathy) - ,
Date Posted: 4/20/2010 12:01 PM ET
Member Since: 12/27/2005
Posts: 4,132
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If you put a book on auto-request, that means it was on your wish list, so by definition, nobody had it and you don't have to worry about cycling through multiple people. You cannot put a book that is on one or more bookshelves on your wish list.

When the book was posted and it was offered to you, the system automatically accepted the offer and requested it for you (that's what auto-request does). If the sender denied your requestor conditions, then you went back on the wish list at your previous spot; if there was also another wisher in line behind you, the book was then offered to that person. If there was nobody behind you, then you stayed on the wish list and the book went onto the sender's shelf (this was a fairly recent change, made maybe a few months ago, previously the book would have gone onto your reminder list). This same copy of the book would not be requested for you again unless you opened up the book details screen and clicked the Order This Book button.

The next copy of the book that was posted would then also be offered to you and auto-requested for you.

So, if you see a request on your My Account page, and you did not take any action to resubmit the request yourself, then you know this is a new request with a new sender.

Date Posted: 4/20/2010 12:11 PM ET
Member Since: 8/16/2007
Posts: 15,187
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With WL books, your request will not go back to the same person, unless you turn off your RCs first. - Again, this is not correct. The request CAN go back to the same sender. It used to be that you could not request a copy that had been denied due to your RCs, that is not the case anymore.

Janette - You would have done nothing wrong to allow the person sent you a book that did not meet your RCs. If they have to turn you down 50 times, that is what they have to do.  I have seen people post in the forums on getting the same requester 3 or 4 times asking for the only copy of the book in the system, but it doesn't meet their RCs and they won't change them so the sender just keeps denying them.

I don't think you could have been 1 of 1 wisher, because upon the denial, you should have had the book removed from your Wish List and put on your Reminder so that their available copy could be listed in the system. If there was another wisher or two, it is possible that copy cycled back to you, but they should still be denying any RCs they cannot meet no matter how many times they see it.

Don't worry about you doing anything wrong. You requested a book under specific conditions.  That is what you should get or you should RWAP it. No one should assume what they are reading does not apply merely because they've seen it before. As you said you have a pretty common RC, how would they know for certain it was the same person?

Sianeka - ,
Date Posted: 4/20/2010 2:33 PM ET
Member Since: 2/8/2007
Posts: 6,630
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Just wanted to note: 

It is a good idea to get into the habit of checking your Main page at least once every time you log into PBS, to see the status of all active transactions. Your Main page is the place where all active transactions are listed, and you can see there what is going on with all of them. 

More reliable than relying on your Emails received or Club Communications to manage your account, and you don't have to wait to receive a status report, you can see what's going on with your account at any time.

 

 

 

 

 



Last Edited on: 4/20/10 2:33 PM ET - Total times edited: 1
Date Posted: 4/20/2010 2:39 PM ET
Member Since: 8/15/2007
Posts: 3,044
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I just refuse to RWAP a sender when it isn't their fault; there is enough who get blamed for something that isn't their fault on both sides of the coin.

Is this book even on its way to you yet?

If it is, you can assume for now that it was a sender who accepted you RCs. If it comes and they haven't been met, then you are in every right to mark it RWAP. I'm not sure how it wouldn't be their fault since they failed to read the rules and assumed seeing an RC twice meant they could ignore it.

If there is no copy on its way, then you can assume the sender(s) are denying your RCs because the book does not meet the conditions.

Date Posted: 4/20/2010 7:33 PM ET
Member Since: 4/7/2007
Posts: 663
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I'm not sure how long it's been an option, but my request of a wishlist book got caught in a loop last week because the member I ordered from clicked on "I cannot mail for other reasons," instead of "My book does not meet conditions."  She got my request (specifying that hardcovers have dust jackets) three times because she'd click that she couldn't mail it for other reasons, which deleted her book from the system. She'd immediately repost the book and it would be offered to me....

She sent me a PM to quit requesting her book (I was the only person on the WL), so I contacted PBS and they told me what was happening. I sent her a PM telling her to choose the 'does not meet conditions' option, and that finally stopped the looping.



Last Edited on: 4/20/10 7:34 PM ET - Total times edited: 1
Date Posted: 4/20/2010 8:07 PM ET
Member Since: 3/4/2007
Posts: 4,546
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With WL books, your request will not go back to the same person, unless you turn off your RCs first. - Again, this is not correct. The request CAN go back to the same sender. It used to be that you could not request a copy that had been denied due to your RCs, that is not the case anymore.

Thanks for the correction.  I apologizing for posting wrong information.

Date Posted: 4/22/2010 7:25 AM ET
Member Since: 4/21/2005
Posts: 6,182
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>With WL books, your request will not go back to the same person, unless you turn off your RCs first. - Again, this is not correct. The request CAN go >back to the same sender. It used to be that you could not request a copy that had been denied due to your RCs, that is not the case anymore.

But, the request should not go to the same sender unless the person turns off their RCs and requests the book again. As Cathy said above, if the sender denies the conditions, you are placed back on the wish list in the same place you were before the book was offered to you. This is a recent change and the book remains on your wish list, it does not get placed onto your reminder list, and if you were the only one with the book on your wish list, the book will  be posted to the senders shelf.

So, for you to be offered the same copy of the book, you would have to physically go to the book details and click on Order this Book again. Chances are that the second book that was posted is the one that was offered to you. I would check the senders name and see if it is different than the first request that was denied for requestor conditions.

Date Posted: 4/22/2010 1:26 PM ET
Member Since: 8/16/2007
Posts: 15,187
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So, for you to be offered the same copy of the book, you would have to physically go to the book details and click on Order this Book again.  Its seems like it would be rare for the request to go back to the same sender without the receiver doing anything, but it can and does happen. If there is a short WL and all get denied for RCs, she'd get the offer back (has happened twice to me) or if the sender cancels instead of denies at any point, when they repost it she'd get the offer back again (has happened at least one to me).

...is a recent change and the book remains on your wish list, it does not get placed onto your reminder list, and if you were the only one with the book on your wish list, the book will  be posted to the senders shelf. - How is this even possible? A book cannot be posted AND wishlisted at the same time. How would the system be able to handle that?

Date Posted: 4/22/2010 3:13 PM ET
Member Since: 8/18/2005
Posts: 7,977
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How is this even possible? A book cannot be posted AND wishlisted at the same time. How would the system be able to handle that?

Why couldn't it? There's no reason the system couldn't see that the only wisher had requested the book and was turned down because the book doesn't meet that RC. It'd be flagged not to be offered to the person with the RC again unless the first removed their RC, making it a new request.

Just flag it on the sender end, or the receivers end, that the WL book was offered and rejected for RC, and then have it ready to go to the next person. It shouldn't be that hard to do, compared to all the other things they program for.