Discussion Forums - Questions about PaperBackSwap Questions about PaperBackSwap

Topic: gun shy about posting books

Club rule - Please, if you cannot be courteous and respectful, do not post in this forum.
  Unlock Forum posting with Annual Membership.
Subject: gun shy about posting books
Date Posted: 4/6/2010 5:31 PM ET
Member Since: 6/9/2009
Posts: 5
Back To Top

Hello, I am having a problem posting books since I recieved a message saying that a previous hardcover book I sent arrived with a problem. I refunded the person the credit so no problems would arise ( I try hard to avoid conflict). But now I am examining all my books and I feel torn about posting any of them that are not pristine. Some are worn in that I recieved from PBS. I am not picky about the books i recieve.  The books in question aren't ripped or stained, no water damage,  covers are present, just worn in and cracks in spine (the paperbacks). The covers on a few have a small corner that is a little bent . I feel very conflicted about posting. Anyone have any advice for me. Thanks a Bunch.

Date Posted: 4/6/2010 5:40 PM ET
Member Since: 9/25/2008
Posts: 3,823
Back To Top

Tara, as long as your books are in postable condition they are fine to send. Sometimes there will be requestor conditions so these are extra conditions the book must meet. So then you just decide if your book meets those conditions. From what you've written I'd say your books are fine to post and find a new home.

Date Posted: 4/6/2010 5:42 PM ET
Member Since: 11/5/2009
Posts: 1,083
Back To Top

If your books meet the posting standards on this site, then by all means post them.  What was the problem the person had with your hardcover?  Was it something about the book having to do with how it was packaged?  Not wrapping books well with plenty of packing tape seems to me to be the culprit for most of the books that arrive damaged and require a RWAP.  As long as your books are postable by PBS standards and you do a good packaging job, you should be fine.  I've been posing here for almost 6 months and haven't had one RWAP.  And few of my books are in "pristine" condition.

Date Posted: 4/6/2010 5:47 PM ET
Member Since: 6/9/2009
Posts: 5
Back To Top

It was a hardcover but I didn't see any request conditions and I pack my books with saran wrap first, then brown shipping paper and tape the PBS address on to the front. I do use too muh saran wrap and tape though:) I am not sure why the person clicked Recieved with a Probem. Thanks for any advice ya'll may have. :)Tara

Date Posted: 4/6/2010 5:57 PM ET
Member Since: 2/24/2009
Posts: 160
Back To Top

Dont they have to state what the problem was?  

Date Posted: 4/6/2010 6:01 PM ET
Member Since: 6/9/2009
Posts: 5
Back To Top

I don't know, I didn't ask. I should have asked. Next time I will.

Date Posted: 4/6/2010 6:04 PM ET
Member Since: 11/11/2005
Posts: 5,238
Back To Top

So you refunded the credit just because it was marked Received With a Problem?  The receiver didn't PM you and ask for the return of their credit?

Date Posted: 4/6/2010 6:06 PM ET
Member Since: 6/9/2009
Posts: 5
Back To Top

No l just refunded right away, I felt bad that and I didn't any problems *if* it was my fault.

Date Posted: 4/6/2010 6:09 PM ET
Member Since: 2/2/2010
Posts: 1,206
Back To Top

I have been a member for about a month now, and now I am worried about some of my books too. Most of my books were used to start with and none are perfect. I would hate to disappoint a recipient - but to me "swapping paperbacks" implies some use and wear and tear on the books. I think I will go back through by list and double check all my books.

Date Posted: 4/6/2010 6:31 PM ET
Member Since: 4/7/2008
Posts: 15,690
Back To Top

As long as your books meet the posting guidelines, you should be fine posting your books. Please don't be shy about posting them because of a bad experience. We have members that have swapped thousands of books with little problem so don't think that every book you send is going to be RWAPed.

Tara - If you have a RWAP in the future, please ask the requestor what the problem is before refunding a credit. Believe it or not, a lot of people RWAP books by mistake and it's always good to know what you're doing wrong to avoid problems in the future.

Date Posted: 4/6/2010 6:51 PM ET
Member Since: 8/10/2005
Posts: 4,599
Back To Top

For you new folks, read over the posting guidelines again, and sure, doublecheck your books if you want to, but if they meet guidelines, go ahead and post them. Sometimes it takes awhile to get a feel for what's okay and what's not. You can always ask specifics here. I usually check my books over three times....once when I get the book, once when I'm done reading it, and then once again when it's requested. If I have any doubts, I will set the book aside and either donate to our reader's shelf here at work in the break room or to the FOL sale or something.

Most of us here expect wear and tear and a little lovin' to the books we get. :) Those who want something better than what the PBS guidelines state should have an RC outlining what they want. If they do not, and if your book was indeed postable, I would not refund the credit and I would not feel bad about it. Some people have these lofty expectations but don't have the Requestor Condition to let you know that. The major things, I think, are first of all that the book is posted by ISBN and that the title/author/format match, so it's the right book, and not an ARC. (Advanced Reader Copy) There should be NO water damage or stains and no writing in the text of the book (flyleaf signature or note is okay) no broken spines with pages falling out. Spine creases are fine. Bent corners are fine. Ex-library books are fine. Yellowing from age is fine. Cover scuffing from use is fine. Post those books! :)

Cheryl

Date Posted: 4/6/2010 7:00 PM ET
Member Since: 6/9/2009
Posts: 5
Back To Top

Thanks for the responses, i am feeling better about posting my books that meet the guidelines and thanks for some good advice on how to approach future instances. Your all peaches :) Later Tara

Date Posted: 4/6/2010 8:05 PM ET
Member Since: 11/14/2005
Posts: 6,421
Back To Top

The other thing to remember for you new members, is that what you read on the forums, is coming from a very small percentage of members of the site. Even including those that you send books to, you will find represent a very small percentage of the membership. We now have over 100,000 members. When you look at the actual "Pulse of PBS" listed at the bottom of the page, it only shows us as having some 80,000+ members, but those are only the members that bother to make a profile for themselves. Many people could care less about that, they just want to trade books. Way back a couple years ago, when we only had about 20,000 members. Someone frome PBS at that time, said that it represented only about 2/3rds of our actual membership. So, if the same thing applies now, and that 80,000+ is only 2/3rds of our actual membership, we are actually over 100,000 members. So, whatever you read or receive from a member or two, will be the opinion of such a small percentage of the membership, that you really need to concentrate on what is in the rules and Help Center more than anything we in the forums might say, or whatever kind of feedback you might receive on any book you send out.

If it meets the guidelines (which are really rules, not suggestions, and it says that in the Help Center) then it's postable. If someone wants a book that has higher standards (such as no creases on the outside of a PB, or must have DJ for HCs) they have to state it in what are called Requestor Conditions (RCs) and you can read about those in the Help Center.

Don't let talk on the forums, or one or two bad trades intimidate you. Use decent courtesy that you would appreciate receiving yourself, make sure your books meet the guidelines (even if you got them from PBS that way, if they don't meet them then don't post them) and you will be fine.

Date Posted: 4/6/2010 8:16 PM ET
Member Since: 9/27/2008
Posts: 370
Back To Top

Nine times out of ten, if you can honestly say you wouldn't mind getting a book in the condition it's in, then you are fine to post it.  Only if you are extremely slobish or the person that orders the book is extremely picky do you have a problem. 

Date Posted: 4/6/2010 8:37 PM ET
Member Since: 8/18/2005
Posts: 7,977
Back To Top

Tara - If you have a RWAP in the future, please ask the requestor what the problem is before refunding a credit. Believe it or not, a lot of people RWAP books by mistake and it's always good to know what you're doing wrong to avoid problems in the future.

Yeah, a RWAP could cover a lot of things, and sometimes people mark them that way by mistake. For example, some people have come new to the site and not realized that a hardback with a missing cover (I mean to say dust jacket!), or a library book, is not a problem according to the site rules. They didn't realize that there was really no problem with the book they got.

Either side of a trade can make an honest mistake.

If they don't ask for their credit back in the RWAP message, then I wouldn't expect you to return a credit. They should specifically ask for it if they really expect it to be returned, and let you know (politely) what the problem was.



Last Edited on: 4/6/10 8:39 PM ET - Total times edited: 1
Date Posted: 4/6/2010 9:19 PM ET
Member Since: 8/23/2007
Posts: 26,510
Back To Top

I wouldn't have returned the credit without asking them the problem first. I had someone RWP a book I sent because they didn't pay attention to what they ordered. They wanted an audiobook but ordered a hardcover, which is what I sent. 

So find out what they are complaining about. You shouldn't have to lose a credit if it was their mistake-like not knowing that a hardcover doesn't have to have a dust jacket or that a name on the inside is allowed. 

If you follow the posting guidelines you should have no problems.

Date Posted: 4/6/2010 9:24 PM ET
Member Since: 4/30/2009
Posts: 2,524
Back To Top

Tara I bet you'll do fine because you are making yourself aware of the posting rules and such.  The times I've had to mark RWAP have usually been because the sender didn't seem to know (or maybe care) about the PBS posting rules.  If you know what they are and it sounds like you do, you will do well, I know I'd order from you knowing that you've looked over your books this carefully. Some people really don't do that and thats probably how some of the RWAPs happen. Go for it!

Date Posted: 4/6/2010 10:21 PM ET
Member Since: 8/15/2007
Posts: 3,044
Back To Top

As long as you are sure that your books are postable then you do not have to refund a credit if someone marks a book RWAP. I wouldn't unless I thought that maybe I had been wrong and missed something. If they're just complaining about something that is postable but obviously been read a few times, then I would simply suggest they set up a requestor condition so they don't run into anymore problems.

Also, like others said, sometimes books are marked RWAP on accident. I did it once myself. It happens. Always make sure you get the reason before you decide what you're going to do.

Date Posted: 4/6/2010 10:24 PM ET
Member Since: 3/5/2009
Posts: 102
Back To Top

Tara, we can't make everyone happy. I understand how you feel. I wanted to close my account when I got my RWAP. Just reacquaint yourself with the posting guidelines and ask yourself if you'd like to receive the book you are posting, and everything will be fine.

Relax and enjoy!

Date Posted: 4/7/2010 1:55 PM ET
Member Since: 9/13/2007
Posts: 2,520
Back To Top

 

Nine times out of ten, if you can honestly say you wouldn't mind getting a book in the condition it's in, then you are fine to post it.  Only if you are extremely slobish or the person that orders the book is extremely picky do you have a problem. 

I'd say instead that if you wouldn't mind paying $3.45 for a book in that condition... but that's still a bit too subjective for my tastes, what is acceptable to one person may not be to another. Your best bet is to just do your best to follow the posting guidelines and ALWAYS find out why a book was RWAP'd before you do anything else. Not receiving a message with an RWAP would send up red flags for me. It very well could have been marked in error. According to the help documents they are required to send a PM stating why they are marking it as such, it isn't an option. If I were you I would go into my transaction archive, find the transaction and make sure there was no further information given. If there wasn't I would send a PM from the transaction archive (so it is attached to that transaction) asking why you never received any information about what was wrong with the book, and if it was perhaps marked RWAP in error. If you don't receive a response I would report them to the team. It is absolutely not ok to mark a book RWAP with no explanation.
Date Posted: 4/7/2010 2:11 PM ET
Member Since: 2/13/2007
Posts: 8,411
Back To Top

Here are the Posting Guidelines for anyone who wants a review:

 

Book Condition Criteria for 'Swappability' at PBS

When you Post a book, you are asked to confirm that the book is "in good condition, and not excessively worn".  It is impossible to list all of the ways in which a book might be considered excessively worn, but the criteria below are as comprehensive as we have been able to make them.

If you feel your book falls into a "grey area", you can either post the book and send a Personal Message to the requestor, or not post the book.  We have delineated what we can, and we expect members to follow these guidelines, and use their common sense in cases that are unclear.  If you would not mind "paying" a credit for a book you are considering posting, then it is probably okay to post.  However, book condition can be a subjective matter.  Keep in mind that a pattern of sending out poor-condition or inappropriate books will jeopardize a sender's membership.

These Guidelines are not suggestions.  They are criteria to which all books Posted here MUST comply.

All of the information below apply both to swapping for credits and Box-O-Books swapping.

General remarks:

  • This is a used-book swapping site; books are not expected to be in like-new condition.
    • Older books may have some page yellowing or spine-creasing or dogeared pages; these are all OKAY.
    • Decirculated library books may have various markings and/or stamps inside or outside or on the page edges of the book; this is OKAY.  These may not obscure text.
    • BookCrossing books may have stickers or stamps or markings on the outside or inside covers or page edges of the book; this is OKAY. These may not obscure text.
    • Hardbacks do NOT have to include their dustjackets.
    • Audiobooks MUST be the original cassettes/CDs, but do NOT have to include the outer "box" that held the set.
    • Audiobooks must be playable.
    • Books that require batteries to work do NOT have to have working batteries.
    • "Playaway" books must include working headphones.
    • There is an exception to general condition guidelines for textbooks; see below.
    • There is an exception to general condition guidelines for cookbooks; see below.
    • There is an exception to general condition guidelines for travel guides; see below.
  • We do NOT have a place for members to describe the condition of a particular copy of a book.
    • ALL books on PBS are expected to be in "good, not excessively worn" condition
    • Books are requested in FIFO (first-in, first-out) order
  • If you would like your books to be in "better-than-PBS" condition :
    • You are responsible for setting Requestor Conditions on your account.

Guidelines:                                                                                                                                       

Overall Condition:

  • No damage at all from water or other liquid
  • Not soiled
  • No stains (exception for cookbooks--see below)
  • No mold
  • no highlighting, underlining or writing on text pages (exception for Textbooks/Workbooks and travel guidebooks --see below)

Dust Jacket:

  • The DUST JACKET (this is not the same as the cover of a book) does not have to be included with a book at all, unless the requestor had this in their Requestor Conditions. 
  • So DUST JACKET condition cannot be considered as part of the condition of a book, unless there were Requestor Conditions on the request specifying that the dust jacket be included.
  • If the Dust Jacket was to be included as specified in the Requestor Conditions on the request, the Dust Jacket must meet the same conditions as defined for the cover, below.

Cover:

  • Must both be present (front and back)
    • note that a paperback missing its front cover is  usually an illegal, unsold copy
    • "cover" does not = dust jacket.  Hardcovers do not need to include their dust jackets to be swapped here.
  • Cover not water damaged (there may be no water damage to any part of the book)
  • Cover not torn or chewed/gnawed
    • some used book stores cut out a small part of the cover; if the amount missing is less than 1 square inch, this is OKAY
    • a small rip (less than 1 inch) in the cover is OKAY
    • yes, that does say "chewed/gnawed" above.  That means no pet-chewed (or human-chewed) books.
  • A bookplate inside the cover or on the flyleaf is OKAY

Binding:

  • Must be intact, with no separation on the inside or outside of the book
  • If the book tends to open at a particular page, this is OKAY
  • Small amount of fraying or denting at top or bottom is OKAY

Pages:

  • No torn or chewed/gnawed pages
    • yes, that does say "chewed/gnawed".  That means no pet-chewed (or human-chewed) books.
  • No loose or missing text pages
    • for travel guide books - maps if designed to be detachable may be detached, but must be included.
  • Cover not water damaged (there may be no water damage to any part of the book)
  • No writing or highlighting or underlining on text pages
    • a signature or note on the flyleaf or inside front or back cover is OKAY
    • an author's signature on the title page is OKAY
    • writing or highlighting or underlining on the text pages is NOT OKAY
      • Exception: if it is a textbook or workbook, these are expected to have highlighting/underlining/writing
        • if you post a textbook/workbook, the condition must be described to the requestor in a Personal Message
        • AND the described condition MUST BE AGREED TO in a reply PM before the book is sent
        • This is the one of the ONLY three cases in which a PM exchange about a book is required before the book can be sent (the others are for travel guidebooks and cookbooks--see below).
      • Exception: if it is a travel guide (not a picture book but a guide, such as Fodor's or Lonely Planet), some writing on text pages could be expected.  All maps must be present and included with the book - if detachable it is OK if they are detached, but they must not be missing.
        • if you post a travel guide that has writing in it, the condition must be described to the requestor in a Personal Message
        • AND the described condition MUST BE AGREED TO in a reply PM before the book is sent
        • This is the one of the ONLY three cases in which a PM exchange about a book is required before the book can be sent (the others are for textbooks/workbooks and cookbooks--see above and below).
  • No staining

    • Exception: Cookbooks may have some mild staining, since these are used in the kitchen and while cooking, and some minor degree of staining could be expected in a used cookbook.  Also a small amount of writing in cookbooks could be expected
    • HOWEVER, if you post a cookbook and it is stained and/or written-in, the condition must be described to the requestor in a Personal Message
  • AND the described condition MUST BE AGREED TO in a reply PM before the book is sent
  • This is the one of the ONLY three cases in which a PM exchange about a book is required before the book can be sent (the others are for travel guidebooks and textbooks/workbooks--see above).
this exception applies to the covers of cookbooks also.
Page edges: remainder marks are OK.  A name written on the page edges is okay (if it does not bleed in and obscure text on the text pages)

Audiobooks

  • Audiobooks must be originals--not copies! 
    • Copies are illegal.  Swapping illegal materials here will get you expelled from the club.
    • burned audio downloads are not permitted on the site--these could be legal (being the only copies you made), but since there is no way to verify this, they are not permitted.
  • Audiobooks do NOT have to include the box that enclosed the individual cassettes/CDs
    • The audiobooks should be packaged well if the box is missing, to prevent damage by USPS en route
    • Audio CDs must be shipped in CD cases/DVD cases, to protect them from scratching, if the original box is missing
  • Audiobooks must be playable to be swapped here, without more than two (minor) skips.
  • "Playaway" audio books must include the headphones (batteries do NOT have to be included).

Interactive books

  • These include popup books and children's books that have interactive functions (LEDs, sounds, etc).
  • The functions must be working (popups not torn, sounds/lights functional etc).
  • If these items have replaceable batteries, these do NOT have to be included.

Supplementary/Accompanying Materials:

  • Books that require supplementary Media materials MAY be posted

    • supplementary Media materials include CD(s)/CD-ROMs/DVD(s)/VHS tape(s)
    • if the book originally included supplementary Media materials, the supplementary materials must accompany the book for the book to be postable.
    • The supplementary materials cannot be posted alone - both the book and the supplementary media must be included in the posting.  
    • These combination listings are valued at 1 credit.
  • Books that require non-Media supplementary materials MAY NOT be posted

    • an example would be a book that requires a decoder or craft materials
    • these items cannot be sent MediaMail
  • Books that originally had accompanying non-Media materials that are not required to read the book (ie, jewelry) MAY be posted.
    • The extra material does not have to be included, and if it is included, the book must not be sent using Media mail rate.
  • Books that require batteries to work do NOT have to include the batteries, but they MUST be in working condition.
  • The member who sends a book that requires batteries must test the book before posting it, and again before sending it.  The batteries do not have to be included when it is shipped (although they can be), but the item must have been tested and working before the item is sent.

Date Posted: 4/7/2010 2:44 PM ET
Member Since: 5/15/2005
Posts: 1,328
Back To Top

Spine creases are OK, but the OP mentions spine cracks, which depending on the degree of the crack, may make a book unpostable. The rules say "Must be intact, with no separation on the inside or outside of the book ", but "If the book tends to open at a particular page, this is OKAY".

I think everyone agrees that a spine break is not postable but I always considered a spine crack to be a separation, and therefore not postable. PBS has clarified that small (pinhole size) separations between pages are allowable. But anything more than that, I'd be cautious about posting.

Date Posted: 4/7/2010 10:50 PM ET
Member Since: 11/14/2005
Posts: 6,421
Back To Top

Spine creases on the outside of a paperback are not at all considered spine cracks or unpostables. There's only a few people that can read a PB for the first time without creasing the outside, and even less that can do so on the second reading of a PB. When she mentions cracks in the spine, she specifically states that she's talking about PBs, so therefore I am assuming she means on the outside, and the word she really wanted was creases not cracks, tho they really can seem like little cracks depending upon the ink from the publisher. They are kind of crinkly crackly, but genereally called creases.