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Topic: Help me understand, please

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Subject: Help me understand, please
Date Posted: 5/30/2012 7:38 PM ET
Member Since: 1/7/2010
Posts: 67
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By nature, I am not a complainer. Rather, if there is a problem to be solved, I search for potential solutions. That being said, I am amazed at what people complain about. I sent a john sanford audiobook to a member. As far as I know, the CDs play without skipping. The member sent this message: The member to whom you shipped your book 'Chosen Prey (Lucas Davenport, Bk 12) (Audio CD) (Abridged)' has sent you this personal message. In the future, I think you should let people know when the condition is questionable. I will still accept this audiobook, but you should know that it is below paper back swap's requirements. My reply was "what is wrong with it?" I have not gotten a reply yet so I don't know what the person is unhappy about. Here is my question. We all know this is a place to swap books, CDs that have been used. Rules are in place about condition etc. Then why do folk complain about books not being in less than pristine condition? Perhaps I am too tolerant but I don't whine if a book gets to me in good condition but I did not have it mummy wrapped or if the pages in a paperback are curled but otherwise fine. I am on a USED media site. I expect acceptable but hope I get something better. Am I missing the bigger picture??? Please help me understand.
Subject: Correction
Date Posted: 5/30/2012 7:44 PM ET
Member Since: 1/7/2010
Posts: 67
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Typing on iPad and can't edit. I meant why do people complain about books etc being in less than pristine condition.
Date Posted: 5/30/2012 8:36 PM ET
Member Since: 10/26/2008
Posts: 9,884
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I don't think it so much that it is less than pristine.  But books should be postable.  If the CDs are the original CDs (and not burned copies) and they were playable, then they're postable.  It is when people send books that are obviously unpostable that I have a problem.

http://www.paperbackswap.com/help/help_item.php?id=205

 

  • Audiobooks MUST be the original cassettes/CDs, but do NOT have to include the outer "box" that held the set.
  • Audiobooks must be playable and have all the CDs/cassettes.
Date Posted: 5/30/2012 8:45 PM ET
Member Since: 8/26/2006
Posts: 9,322
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Maybe it had "more than three (minor) skips" -- that would make it unpostable.  Or maybe she thought the box had to be included (it doesn't.)  See the link JonnieAngel referenced above.

Date Posted: 5/30/2012 9:06 PM ET
Member Since: 4/6/2007
Posts: 1,391
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Last Edited on: 9/23/12 9:29 PM ET - Total times edited: 5
Date Posted: 5/30/2012 11:50 PM ET
Member Since: 8/31/2008
Posts: 80
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I agree with Julie.....A Issue I have found on my own CD's is that some that had lots of skips in my old car, play without issue in my new car.....10 years difference in the age of the cars.   I think newer players deal with scratches better than the older players.   So I send you cd's that played fine in my car, and you get lots of skips in your car or older cd player.   For me, I had previously just accepted that there would be skips on used cd's.   JMO

Date Posted: 5/31/2012 12:40 AM ET
Member Since: 8/16/2007
Posts: 15,185
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I expect acceptable but hope I get something better.

People expect postable, not acceptable. As long as you are posting things that meet the site rules for posting condition, then you are fine. If you are posting things that are less than that and you think people should take them because they are acceptable to you and it is a swap site, then that would not be fine. Without waiting to hear what the problem was with the audiobook, there is no way to know if the compaint is legit or not. Just make sure you listen to audios to check for swappability before mailing and if they have less than 3 skips then they are postable and you can suggest that the receiver try a different player.

Date Posted: 5/31/2012 9:13 AM ET
Member Since: 8/23/2007
Posts: 26,510
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They weren't by chance MP3 discs were they?  I've had people order these from me and I always make sure it says that it's an MP3.  I will even submit an edit and then wait to post it until the edit is made if I have to.  But even with the listing clearly saying it's an MP3, I've had people pm me afterwards saying they didn't realize it was an MP3 and they can't play it on anything but their computer.  I did not refund a credit and I don't PM to make sure people know it's an MP3.  They need to research those things themselves. 

I had one person complain about an audiobook I sent that wasn't an MP3.  I bought the discs brand new and listened to them once in my car.  They played just fine.  She couldnt' play them for some reason. I didn't refund the credit.  If I had bought them used and didn't listen to them then I would have. But these were brand new, listened to once.

Date Posted: 5/31/2012 1:12 PM ET
Member Since: 12/28/2006
Posts: 14,167
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Kinda unfair (and confusing) to complain and not explain why.  How does the other member expect you to improve if she doesn't define the problem?



Last Edited on: 5/31/12 1:14 PM ET - Total times edited: 1
Subject: So far, no update
Date Posted: 5/31/2012 2:53 PM ET
Member Since: 1/7/2010
Posts: 67
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All,

The person I wrote about has not yet replied or explained what is wrong with the CDs.  Hopefully, I will learn something from them. 

In reply to people's posts:  the CDs were postable.  They played without skipping.  The box was soft around some of the corners but not against the rules.If there was a problem, I would have given back credits as I have gone above and beyond for others. 

Julie, your post had me nodding in agreement.  (Glad you were not a salesperson because I would have been persuaded to buy what you were selling. LOL).  Quite often, when I receive CDs, I look through them and note to the sender that there are lots of scratches that may affect play.  This gives me a chance to request a refund if it proves too bad.  Only one time did I have to request a refund all the other times, things worked out fine.  I did not see any missing disks. 

David, you are right about CDs playing on one device but not another.  I usually clean them and polish with a CD cloth to see if that changes how it plays. 

Melanie, when I said acceptable but hope I get better, I was refering to acceptable under club rules.  I have gotten what I interpret as snide remarks that "you should wrap your package before mailing" or "The CDs are fine but the box was bent", or "I think you should have written me to say I ordered an MP3 disk".  To my thinking, I should have them properly listed by ISBN,  not skip, protected from breakage by postal service delivery, and if a book not be damaged so they are not postable.  If there is a RC that I am uncomfortable with, I decline to send. 

Again, I think of this site as a cool flea market.  I hope to get something brand new for minimal money.  If I get something I like/want and it is a little bit used but costs the $$ I am willing to spend, I am happy because I satisfied a desire and did not have to break the bank. 

That being said, thank you all for sharing your thoughts.  I will wait for the poster's response and share what I learn. 

Happy reading!!!  I am off to order more books....

Subject: I'm confused too.
Date Posted: 5/31/2012 4:33 PM ET
Member Since: 5/4/2009
Posts: 89
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I have never complained.  The only books that I have ever gotten complaints about were books that I sent on after getting them on the club.  I think there should be a scale depending on the probable age of the book, not formally, but that's what I judge by.  The only real complaint I've had was for a book I got on the club, paperback, about 30 years in print.  To my knowledge there are no newer editions of the book, and it has not been reprinted.  The person complained to the club, said there were stains, which I did not see, and the pages were wavy.  I did see the wavy pages, but I know that it is possible for the pages to be wavy where there is no real water damage.  They did not ask for their credit back, and I sent them a nastygram, which I got called out by the club for.  I didn't really think it was a nastygram too much myself, certainly no more than what the other person sent directly to the club and not directly to me at all.  I have gotten over all the conditions people put in.  I just refuse their requests now because I don't know what they want at all. 

The extent of the pickiness on this site is incredible to me.  I would never complain when someone has gone to the trouble of spending their own hard-earned cash sending me a book.  I have gotten seriously water damaged books.  I have gotten books clearly not marked as textbooks that were highlighted and written in throughout.  If I get a book through the club, I will pass it on through the club.  I would not send out a book like that from my own collection unless it were very old and not easily obtainable otherwise.  I agree with audiolady about this.  There's a limit.  If it gets much worse I will probably just lay low for awhile and keep my older unwanted things listed and not post my new hot things at all rather than have to get upset about this all the time.  I also don't understand what all these abbreviations mean, especially the ones related to book conditions.  I am really confused about what is unpostable at this point.   If anyone can help with this, please point me in the right direction.  I have gotten some good books here and sent some along too, and do not want to leave, because at least here once in awhile it seems like someone appreciates it, unlike Half Price Books.  Help!

Date Posted: 5/31/2012 4:37 PM ET
Member Since: 2/5/2007
Posts: 30,800
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When confused always go to the Help Center - it will answer almost all of your questions and certainly the ones about what to post or not to post.

 

ALL books at PBS must meet Book Condition Criteria.



Last Edited on: 5/31/12 4:40 PM ET - Total times edited: 1
Date Posted: 5/31/2012 4:39 PM ET
Member Since: 2/5/2007
Posts: 30,800
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ALSO from the help center

 

When you Post a book, you are asked to confirm that the book is "in good condition, and not excessively worn".  It is impossible to list all of the ways in which a book might be considered excessively worn, but the criteria below are as comprehensive as we have been able to make them.

If you feel your book falls into a "grey area", you can either post the book and send a Personal Message to the requestor, or not post the book.  We have delineated what we can, and we expect members to follow these guidelines, and use their common sense in cases that are unclear.  If you would not mind "paying" a credit for a book you are considering posting, then it is probably okay to post.  However, book condition can be a subjective matter.  Keep in mind that a pattern of sending out poor-condition or inappropriate books will jeopardize a sender's membership.

These Guidelines are not suggestions.  They are criteria to which all books Posted here MUST comply.

All of the information below apply both to swapping for credits and Box-O-Books swapping.

General remarks:

  • This is a used-book swapping site; books are not expected to be in like-new condition.
    • Older books may have some page yellowing or spine-creasing or dogeared pages; these are all OKAY.
    • Decirculated library books may have various markings and/or stamps inside or outside or on the page edges of the book; this is OKAY.  These may not obscure text.
    • BookCrossing books may have stickers or stamps or markings on the outside or inside covers or page edges of the book; this is OKAY. These may not obscure text.
    • Hardbacks do NOT have to include their dustjackets.
    • Audiobooks MUST be the original cassettes/CDs, but do NOT have to include the outer "box" that held the set.
    • Audiobooks must be playable and have all the CDs/cassettes.
    • Books that require batteries to work do NOT have to have working batteries.
    • "Playaway" books must include working headphones.
    • Since this is a used-book swap, members should not expect to receive non-Media items with the books.
    • There is an exception to general condition guidelines for textbooks; see below.
    • There is an exception to general condition guidelines for cookbooks; see below.
    • There is an exception to general condition guidelines for travel guides; see below.
  • We do NOT have a place for members to describe the condition of a particular copy of a book.
    • ALL books on PBS are expected to be in "good, not excessively worn" condition
    • Books are requested in FIFO (first-in, first-out) order
  • If you would like your books to be in "better-than-PBS" condition :
    • You are responsible for setting Requestor Conditions on your account.

Guidelines:                                                                                                                                       

Overall Condition:

  • No damage at all from water or other liquid
  • Not soiled
  • No stains (exception for cookbooks--see below)
  • No mold
  • no highlighting, underlining or writing on text pages (exception for Textbooks/Workbooks and travel guidebooks --see below)

Dust Jacket:

  • The DUST JACKET (this is not the same as the cover of a book) does not have to be included with a book at all, unless the requestor had this in their Requestor Conditions. 
  • So DUST JACKET condition cannot be considered as part of the condition of a book, unless there were Requestor Conditions on the request specifying that the dust jacket be included.
  • If the Dust Jacket was to be included as specified in the Requestor Conditions on the request, the Dust Jacket must meet the same conditions as defined for the cover, below.

Cover:

  • Must both be present (front and back)
    • note that a paperback missing its front cover is  usually an illegal, unsold copy
    • "cover" does not = dust jacket.  Hardcovers do not need to include their dust jackets to be swapped here.
  • Cover not water damaged (there may be no water damage to any part of the book)
  • Cover not torn or chewed/gnawed
    • some used book stores cut out a small part of the cover; if the amount missing is less than 1 square inch, this is OKAY
    • a small rip (less than 1 inch) in the cover is OKAY
    • yes, that does say "chewed/gnawed" above.  That means no pet-chewed (or human-chewed) books.
  • A bookplate inside the cover or on the flyleaf is OKAY

Binding:

  • Must be intact, with no separation on the inside or outside of the book
  • If the book tends to open at a particular page, this is OKAY
  • Small amount of fraying or denting at top or bottom is OKAY

Pages:

  • No torn or chewed/gnawed pages
    • yes, that does say "chewed/gnawed".  That means no pet-chewed (or human-chewed) books.
  • No loose or missing text pages
    • for travel guide books - maps if designed to be detachable may be detached, but must be included.
  • Cover not water damaged (there may be no water damage to any part of the book)
  • No writing or highlighting or underlining on text pages
    • a signature or note on the flyleaf or inside front or back cover is OKAY
    • an author's signature on the title page is OKAY
    • writing or highlighting or underlining on the text pages is NOT OKAY
      • Exception: if it is a textbook or workbook, these are expected to have highlighting/underlining/writing
        • if you post a textbook/workbook, the condition must be described to the requestor in a Personal Message
        • AND the described condition MUST BE AGREED TO in a reply PM before the book is sent
        • This is the one of the ONLY three cases in which a PM exchange about a book is required before the book can be sent (the others are for travel guidebooks and cookbooks--see below).
      • Exception: if it is a travel guide (not a picture book but a guide, such as Fodor's or Lonely Planet), some writing on text pages could be expected.  All maps must be present and included with the book - if detachable it is OK if they are detached, but they must not be missing.
        • if you post a travel guide that has writing in it, the condition must be described to the requestor in a Personal Message
        • AND the described condition MUST BE AGREED TO in a reply PM before the book is sent
        • This is the one of the ONLY three cases in which a PM exchange about a book is required before the book can be sent (the others are for textbooks/workbooks and cookbooks--see above and below).
    • No staining

      • Exception: Cookbooks may have some mild staining, since these are used in the kitchen and while cooking, and some minor degree of staining could be expected in a used cookbook.  Also a small amount of writing in cookbooks could be expected
        • HOWEVER, if you post a cookbook and it is stained and/or written-in, the condition must be described to the requestor in a Personal Message
        • AND the described condition MUST BE AGREED TO in a reply PM before the book is sent
        • This is the one of the ONLY three cases in which a PM exchange about a book is required before the book can be sent (the others are for travel guidebooks and textbooks/workbooks--see above).
    • this exception applies to the covers of cookbooks also.
  • Page edges: remainder marks are OK.  A name written on the page edges is okay (if it does not bleed in and obscure text on the text pages)

Audiobooks

  • Audiobooks must be originals--not copies!
    • Copies are illegal.  Swapping illegal materials here will get you expelled from the club.
    • burned audio downloads are not permitted on the site--these could be legal (being the only copies you made), but since there is no way to verify this, they are not permitted.
  • Audiobooks do NOT have to include the box that enclosed the individual cassettes/CDs
    • The audiobooks should be packaged well if the box is missing, to prevent damage by USPS en route
    • Audio CDs must be shipped in a way that will protect them from scratching (CD cases/DVD cases work well), if the original box is missing
  • Audiobooks must be playable to be swapped here, without more than three (minor) skips.
  • "Playaway" audio books must include the headphones (batteries do NOT have to be included).

Ex-library Books

  • The posting member must check that the library book has been withdrawn/decirculated from the library collection . This is easy to do:
    • Check the pages/cover for "WITHDRAWN" stamps or the equivalent.
    • If no stamps or notations are visible, contact the library (you can find the telephone number using a Google search for the library), provide the number on the book (they'll tell you where to find it on the book) and they can confirm its status.

Interactive Books

  • These include popup and lift-the-flap books and children's books that have interactive functions (LEDs, sounds, etc).
    • The functions must be working (popups/flaps not torn or missing, sounds/lights functional etc).
    • If these items have replaceable batteries, these do NOT have to be included. Each item must be tested and verified that it is working before it is posted though.

Supplementary/Accompanying Materials:

  • Books that originally came with supplementary Media materials may be posted -  the supplementary Media materials MUST be included.

    • supplementary Media materials include CD(s)/CD-ROMs/DVD(s)/VHS tape(s)
    • if the book originally included supplementary Media materials, the supplementary materials must accompany the book for the book to be postable.
    • The supplementary materials cannot be posted alone - both the book and the supplementary media must be included in the posting.  
    • These combination listings are valued at 1 credit.
  • Books that require non-Media supplementary materials MAY NOT be posted

    • an example would be a book that requires a decoder or craft materials
    • these items cannot be sent MediaMail
    • These items cannot be posted here - because a used book cannot be expected to have original accompanying NON-media items, and if the book is not usable without the non-media items, the book must not be posted.
  • Books that originally had accompanying non-Media materials that are not required to read the book (ie, jewelry) MAY be posted.
    • The extra material does not have to be included, and if it is included, the book must not be sent using Media mail rate.
    • Since this is a used-book swap, members should not expect to receive non-Media items with their books.
  • Books that require batteries to work do NOT have to include the batteries, but the books MUST be in working condition.
  • The member who sends a book that requires batteries must test the book before posting it, and again before sending it.  The batteries do not have to be included when it is shipped (although they can be), but the item must have been tested and working before the item is sent.
Date Posted: 5/31/2012 4:43 PM ET
Member Since: 1/17/2009
Posts: 9,670
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The extent of the pickiness on this site is incredible to me.  I would never complain when someone has gone to the trouble of spending their own hard-earned cash sending me a book.  I have gotten seriously water damaged books.  I have gotten books clearly not marked as textbooks that were highlighted and written in throughout.  If I get a book through the club, I will pass it on through the club.  I would not send out a book like that from my own collection unless it were very old and not easily obtainable otherwise.

I don't think that people are picky here at all. But, books must be postable for you to send them to someone else, whether you got them here or not. Just because you get a water damaged book from a member here, does not mean its OK to pass it on.

If you don't complain, that's on you. But don't expect others to accept blatently unpostable books just because you received them from someone at PBS and didn't complain about it.

Nobody that you send a book to, knows whether or not it came from someone else here at PBS, or from your "personal collection". If you send a book, it's from you. It was yours. You were the owner.

Date Posted: 5/31/2012 4:44 PM ET
Member Since: 2/5/2007
Posts: 30,800
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If you are accepting books that do NOT meet the Book Condition Criteria  and passing them along to others they have a right to check received with a problem.  Just because you got it from someone else here does not mean you can just automatically post it.  It is up to YOU the receiver to check the book, mark it received with a problem if it doesn't meet the book conditions and NOT post it yourself.

Subject: Yes, but
Date Posted: 5/31/2012 5:37 PM ET
Member Since: 5/4/2009
Posts: 89
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I understand what you are saying.  I know what the rules are.  I've read them all several times.  I'm not trying to be sarcastic at all, but I feel that's behind these responses.  I don't agree that everything is in the rules.  I don't think that anything I've sent out has been unpostable.  That's the problem.  I think there is a gray area, and I'm trying to understand what the line is in there so I don't continue top run afoul.  I understand you both saying I should complain, but I don't want to feel forced to do that either.  That's asking for a fight just as much. What does ARC mean?  What does RWAP mean?  Not in anything in the help section at all.  I just don't see complaining to prevent complaining about me as a solution to this.  I guess part of it is I don't want to get that picky about all of this because I just don't think it warrants that much attention, but I got myself into it, so I guess I want to try to stick it out, too.  What are these abbreviations about?

Subject: Sorry to audiolady
Date Posted: 5/31/2012 5:38 PM ET
Member Since: 5/4/2009
Posts: 89
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I'm sorry.  I did not mean to commandeer your thread at all.  It just seemed like it was the other side of the coin of the same issues.

Date Posted: 5/31/2012 5:45 PM ET
Member Since: 1/30/2009
Posts: 5,696
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Check out the PBS Glossary in the Help Section. You may find that helpful.

To be honest, I've had very few problems. Obviously, YMMV.

Date Posted: 6/1/2012 1:23 AM ET
Member Since: 2/5/2007
Posts: 30,800
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PBS Glossary

Glossary of Common Acronyms/Abbreviations

Acronyms/Abbreviations common on PBS:

  • ARC = Advanced Reader Copy (aka Uncorrected Proof, Review Copy); a preview copy of a book sent to reviewers in advance of a book's release; not the final copy of a book, and not permitted for swapping at PBS.
  • BCE = Book Club Edition.  Book club editions are special printings of books that use cheaper materials and are slightly smaller in size than standard hardcovers. They're usually sent out via mail order book clubs, hence the name, and sometimes do not have ISBNS (if this is the case, they must be Posted using the Post a Book without an ISBN feature).  They are permitted for swapping at PBS.
  • BIR = Books I've Read List. This is a list of all the books you have already read.
  • BoB = Box-O-Books. This service allows members to swap books without credits! See What is Box-O-Books? for more information about this feature.
  • Boxer = member subscribed to Box-O-Books.
  • BX = BookCrossing. BookCrossing.com is a website unaffiliated with PBS. BX books often have stamps or stickers on them, with their BX registration numbers.
  • FIFO = "first in, first out". FIFO refers to the order in which books are requested at PBS. See What is FIFO? for more information.
  • FOL = Friends of the Library, an organization which runs sales of decirculated library books.
  • ISBN = International Standard Book Number, usually found on the back or inside front flyleaf of a book.
  • PBS-DC = PBS Delivery Confirmation. See What is PBS Delivery Confirmation? for more information about this feature.
  • PM = Personal Message. You can read your PMs in your Message Center, by clicking Personal Message on the right-hand side of your account page.
  • Posted books = books currently available to order.
  • RCs - Requestor Conditions
  • RL = Reminder List. This is a list of the books you are considering ordering in future. See What is the Reminder List? for more information.
  • RWAP = Received with a Problem.  This refers to a problem swap - such as a damaged book, a wrong book, a book that violates your RCs, etc.  Please see There is a problem with a book I received! for more information.
  • TBR = To Be Read (click the "show description" button on the TBR Pile page to read the full description of its purpose. The TBR Pile is in the dropdown menu under Book Lists on the right-hand side of your account page)
  • TG - Tour Guide
  • UnPosted books = books not currently available to order; these books may be added to your Wish List.
  • UBS = Used Book Store
  • USPS = United States Postal Service
  • WL = Wish List. See What is the Wish List? for more information.

Acronyms/Abbreviations common on the Internet in general:

  • AFAIK = As Far As I Know
  • BRB = Be Right Back
  • BTW = By The Way
  • bump (as the lone word in a Forum post) = Bump Up My Post = empty post added to bring topic back to top of Forum topic list.  This is permissible in Book Bazaar topics once per day per topic.
  • DH, DW = Dear Husband, Dear Wife
  • DS, DD = Dear Son, Dear Daughter
  • ETA = Edited to Add. Used mainly on a forum post that has been edited, to explain why the editing was done.
  • FWIW = For What It's Worth
  • HTH = Hope That (or "This") Helps
  • IIRC = If I Recall Correctly
  • ISO = In Search Of
  • KWIM = Know What I Mean?
  • LOL = Laughing Out Loud
  • NM = Never Mind
  • NP = No Problem
  • OP = Original Poster (or Original Post). Used mainly in Discussion Forums, to refer to the post that started the topic OR the person who started the topic.
  • OTOH = On The Other Hand
  • OT = Off-Topic
  • ROFL = Rolling On the Floor Laughing
  • ROFLMAO = Rolling On the Floor Laughing My A** Off
  • SIL, MIL, FIL, BIL = sister-in-law, mother-in-law, father-in-law, brother-in-law
  • TTFN = Ta-Ta For Now
  • TTYL = Talk To You Later
  • YMMV = Your Mileage May Vary
Date Posted: 6/1/2012 7:37 AM ET
Member Since: 4/7/2008
Posts: 15,690
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I think there is a gray area, and I'm trying to understand what the line is in there so I don't continue top run afoul.  I understand you both saying I should complain, but I don't want to feel forced to do that either.  That's asking for a fight just as much.

Elizabeth - Marking a book received with a problem (RWAP) is not complianing. It's just following the rules of the site (which we all agree when we first sign up.) You don't have to request a credit back if you don't want to, but the site works better if everybody does their part by RWAPing unpostables because that tells the PBS Team which members are not following the rules.

If I have a doubt about whether a book is postable or not, I just don't post it. But I also give senders the benefit of the doubt when I received books. A few times I've gotten books that are a bit too worn out that I accept fine because they follow the rules but I know I won't post them forward. Any book I received that makes me check the rules of whether is postable or not is a book I won't post to the system again.

But that's what's worked for me.

 

Date Posted: 6/1/2012 11:24 AM ET
Member Since: 1/17/2009
Posts: 9,670
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OK, I see a little more. Yes, there are lots of gray areas in the postability rules.

Here is how I decide whether or not to send anyway, when a book has a condition that is not mentioned in the rules.

All of the postability rules are designed to avoid members sending other members books that are:

1. gross in any way (water and liquid damage, stains, dirt, mold, mildew, etc), OR

2. unreadable (missing pages, writing and highlighting inside, etc), OR

3. falling apart (broken spine, pages loose, excessive wear, rips in cover larger than an inch, etc)

The reason that the rules say "NO water damage" for example .... is that there is absolutely no way to quantify the amount of damage that might be OK vs. the amount that is not. Therefore, the rules just say NONE. Yes, everybody knows perfectly well that one drop of water does not ruin a copy of a book "in real life" ... however, for the purposes of posting it at PBS, even one drop of water does make it unacceptable for regular trading here. Because there is no way to say that "one drop is OK, but 4 drops are not". Get my drift here? It would lead to endless arguments. So, the rules say "NONE" and that's what you have to go by.

So, when I have a questionable item ... like say the book has an extra sticker or three on the cover (which would be ouside the norm). I decide if those stickers make the book gross in any way (like maybe the are coming unstuck or something). Or unreadable. Or falling apart. If the answer is yes, then I don't post the book. If the answer is no, then I post the book.

I am definitely not one of those people who only mails out "like-new" books (although I do have plenty of those too)

I feel perfectly fine sending "gray area" books to other members. Really, perfectly fine.

However, I am pretty scruptulous about "my own" gray area rules.

I've got plenty of books to mail out, so I don't worry about it when I have to discard something that becomes unacceptable to mail out here.



Last Edited on: 6/1/12 11:28 AM ET - Total times edited: 2
Date Posted: 6/1/2012 11:58 AM ET
Member Since: 12/31/2009
Posts: 3,995
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The reason that the rules say "NO water damage" for example .... is that there is absolutely no way to quantify the amount of damage that might be OK vs. the amount that is not. yes

This is exactly why calling people "picky" really gets my back up. If I get a book that has 4 or 5 pages with a small water stain on them I mark the book RWAP, not because I feel i got a nasty book. I do it because I got an unpostable book according to the site's guidelines, and I refuse to let someone pass the problem on to me. 

If I said "oh, that's not much of a stain" and marked it received normally, it then becomes my responsibility if/when I pass it on to someone else. Or, I choose not to pass it on and have lost a credit for a book that shouldn't have been posted in the first place.

The rules are simple, not picky

Date Posted: 6/1/2012 6:09 PM ET
Member Since: 10/26/2008
Posts: 9,884
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The extent of the pickiness on this site is incredible to me.  I would never complain when someone has gone to the trouble of spending their own hard-earned cash sending me a book. 

I recently had to buy credits because some of my wish list books were posted all at once.  The credits weren't cheap for me.

I usually only send out brand new wish list books.  Those books are not cheap & the postage isn't cheap, either.  If I'm sending out pristine books, I do not want to receive a book that shouldn't have been posted to begin with.  I don't care how much they had to pay for postage, because the credit I spent on that book cost me money.

I agree with the others that said it wasn't fair of her to complain without giving all of the information.  At least she didn't ask for a refund.

Subject: okkkkkkkk
Date Posted: 6/3/2012 5:55 AM ET
Member Since: 5/4/2009
Posts: 89
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Thank you!  I understand better now. I'm finally starting to get it.  I will abide by this, but I still don't agree.  If all these books were going to be so great then why is it a club and why aren't people selling all these beautiful perfect books?  I know!  A credit is not nothing and it's easier that dealing with these used bookstores.   I see people trading the upostables.  i will probably start doing that!   Thanks again.  Very helpful discussion.  I really appreciate it.

Date Posted: 6/3/2012 11:51 AM ET
Member Since: 1/30/2009
Posts: 5,696
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I don't sell my books because taking the time to sell second hand books (which have almost zero actual monetary value) isn't worth my time. Books I don't trade get put out on my stoop, released into the wild, where they are snappd up right away. To take the time to list them and monitor a store on ebay and/or Amazon is really not something I have any interest in doing with a product with a shockingly narrow (and tiny) profit margin. I'd rather trade my postable books for other books. Easy peasy. I just want books I can post. If I cannot repost, I will mark the book RWAP and leave it on my stoop. If this is not something you enjoy: fine. PBS isn't for everyone (what is?). 

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