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Topic: Mark Problem With Book or Not?-Update

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Subject: Mark Problem With Book or Not?-Update
Date Posted: 6/18/2011 7:15 PM ET
Member Since: 3/1/2009
Posts: 273
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I've been a member for awhile now and have been blessed to get great books, all in postable condition so far. Today, I recieved my very first book that I may have to mark a problem with but I wanted to get a second opinion (or more!) before I do so. The book was a wishlisted book that I eagerly waited awhile for and i want to make sure that I treat the member that sent the book with respect, as I checked and found that the sender had sent out only 20 books so far and I would hate to scare off a new member. The problem is that upon my inspection,  there is underlining throughout the book, with  six or seven comments writen in pen in the margins. Could anyone suggest a message for the sender?  I would like my credit back, as I will have to reorder the book now from someone else but I really want to leave both parties feeling okay with the situation. Thanks so much for any help!



Last Edited on: 6/20/11 6:13 PM ET - Total times edited: 1
Date Posted: 6/18/2011 7:26 PM ET
Member Since: 7/7/2007
Posts: 4,815
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If they didn't contact you about the issue prior to sending (under the Textbook Exception), you should mark it RWAP, Sender damaged.  Asking for your credit back or not is up to you, but definitely mark it with a problem -- otherwise, the sender misses a chance to better understand the rules.

There is some suggested wording in the Help Center, under "There's a problem with a book I received!"

Date Posted: 6/18/2011 7:31 PM ET
Member Since: 1/8/2009
Posts: 2,016
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I usually include a line such as (lifted from someone else; sorry I couldn't remember who to attribute) : "I know we're all human and accidents happen, so I have no hard feelings."

I try to cover all the bases I can think of:

  • Thank them for sending the book.
  • Describe the factors that make the book unpostable.
  • I take pictures, post them online, and provide a URL (optional)
  • I will mark it "resolved" once they return the credit.
  • I will mail the book back to them if they return the credit and send postage first (to preempt the "I'll refund the credit(s) once I receive the book" type replies)
  • I hope to hear from them within one week.

So far I've had success. Since I've done this, the vast majority of people have returned the credit (with a minority grumbling). One person sent 2 credits because she wanted the book back,  and there's one person who says he's sending me another copy which hasn't arrived yet. (Keeping fingers crossed.)

Date Posted: 6/18/2011 7:32 PM ET
Member Since: 12/26/2010
Posts: 68
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Under the textbook rule, the other member should have PM-ed you before sending the book to make sure that the markings were acceptable to you. Assuming she did not PM you, you would be justified in RWAP-ing the book. You could politely explain the textbook policy, or copy the texbook guidelines from the help documents in your message to the sender.

It's possible she either wasn't aware of the textbook policy or maybe she got the book from someone else and didn't check it thoroughly and didn't see the underlining.

You technically could re-post the book as long as you then PM-ed the requestor detailing the underlining and ask if they still want it.

smiley

Date Posted: 6/18/2011 7:35 PM ET
Member Since: 1/8/2009
Posts: 2,016
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Cattriona and Diane are correct -- there's a Textbook exception which involves PM first.

However, the sender PMing you with a description of the markings is not sufficient -- you need to have responded with a PM approving the condition. If there's no response the sender needs to cancel the transaction on her side. 

Just some FYI in case you wish to re-post the marked-up copy.

Date Posted: 6/18/2011 8:45 PM ET
Member Since: 3/1/2009
Posts: 273
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Thank you all who have responded so far. I didn't think of the textbook exeption until it was mentioned above, as its not what I would consider a textbook, but a novel, but that could be where the mistake was made as I know the book is popular for book studies and such. I recieved no PM beforehand, so I believe I'll attempt to write a message using the above suggestions. Thank you so much!

Date Posted: 6/18/2011 9:14 PM ET
Member Since: 8/8/2008
Posts: 2
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This is my second post to the forums, so sorry if it's not the right place to add my question or comment to the OP's post...  (LOL did that make sense?)

 

I received two books today and I was disappointed with their condition (from different senders!) Both were packaged very well, but one had some pages that are clearly water damaged. They are very slightly stained and wrinked. The book is still readable though. The other book, the tops of the pages - how do i describe this - when the book is closed and you are looking at all the pages - the top and around to the side is VERY discolored. At first I thought it was supposed to be that color and thought it weird, but when I looked at the bottom, the pages were white.  I sent both members messages that I marked the books received in "good condition" but they should chech their books better before sending. Did I do the right thing?

Date Posted: 6/18/2011 10:38 PM ET
Member Since: 1/8/2009
Posts: 2,016
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I received two books today and I was disappointed with their condition (from different senders!) Both were packaged very well, but one had some pages that are clearly water damaged. They are very slightly stained and wrinked. The book is still readable though.

Whether marking this book "received in good condition" in this case is debatable. The condition sounds unpostable. Some people say members have an obligation to mark books with a problem as such in order to (1) send correct signals to the site for purposes of monitoring problem senders and (2) to provide negative reinforcement to people sending out bad books. Whether to ask for the credit back is up to the recipient.

Others say it's up to the comfort level of the individual recipient; after all, it's her credit.

 

The other book, the tops of the pages - how do i describe this - when the book is closed and you are looking at all the pages - the top and around to the side is VERY discolored. At first I thought it was supposed to be that color and thought it weird, but when I looked at the bottom, the pages were white. 

I am not sure this book is unpostable. I've seen the top edge of books change color more than the other edges -- maybe this is due to the top edge being exposed more to the air more? (When books are stored on a bookshelf, the long edge and bottom edge are touch the shelf.)  So I personally would not mark this RWAP. I probably wouldn't send a message to the sender, but that's just me.

Welcome to the forums. smiley

Date Posted: 6/18/2011 11:52 PM ET
Member Since: 1/17/2009
Posts: 9,722
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Paper can discolor from exposure to the sun, heat exposure, and age, none of which make the book unpostable.

The water damaged one, though, consider marking those RWAP when you get them.

Date Posted: 6/19/2011 1:10 AM ET
Member Since: 12/28/2006
Posts: 14,171
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Regarding the OP, the books could have been offered to you under the Textbook waiver (and the required procedure).  Unfortunately, many new members do not understand yet (so be gentle when you pm).  Without following the specific Textbook guidelines, the book is RWAP.

Date Posted: 6/20/2011 6:12 PM ET
Member Since: 3/1/2009
Posts: 273
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Update on how the PM went:

I wish it had been a positive experience frown The sender stated I send the book back to her, but I still haven't received the credit I asked for, nor anything to pay for the extra shipping back. The sender basically told me that underlining and comments in the margin should be overlooked and that my “pickiness” took the fun out of the site sad. Two years on this site with nary a problem and I landed this. It’s enough to make me just bite my tongue and accept the book, lick my wounds, and pray for two more years without more problem books. Any recommendation on how to respond back to her request to send the book back (keeping in mind I haven’t received either credit?)

 

Date Posted: 6/20/2011 6:57 PM ET
Member Since: 7/29/2005
Posts: 641
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I might not be as nice a person as you for I would respond, "What REALLY takes the fun out of this site, are members who violate the posting criteria and then have the gall to try and make the receiver feel guilty for noticing." and then I would mark it unresolved and hope Bad Book Karma bites them in the a$$.
Date Posted: 6/20/2011 7:26 PM ET
Member Since: 12/31/2009
Posts: 3,995
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Oh, I just love these guys. Shame on you for ruining her fun! Did you make her cry? Gimme a break...

At this point, she's admitted to sending you an unpostable book, is still refusing to follow guidelines by dictating when and how you'll get your credit back, and is making up her own rules (all of which benefit her only) as she goes. Why bother talking to her any more?

Personally, I'd mark the transaction unresolved, then send a PM using the "contact us" link at the bottom of the page. They do not like people ignoring the rules, and since she admitted in a PM that she knew about the problem, they may intervene.



Last Edited on: 6/20/11 7:28 PM ET - Total times edited: 1
Date Posted: 6/20/2011 8:49 PM ET
Member Since: 12/26/2010
Posts: 68
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Too bad you got a sour puss. I would suggest responding matter-of-factly that you're sorry she feels that way. However you would still like a credit returned for the RWAP and an additional credit for return postage if she wants the book back. Give her a deadline by which to send the credits then let her know that if she doesn't respond you'll have to mark the transaction unresolved and move on. Whether you report the whole thing to TPTB is up to you - but it couldn't hurt. I wouldn't give her the satisfaction of knowing that her attitude bothered you.

 

Good Luck! :)

Date Posted: 6/20/2011 9:19 PM ET
Member Since: 9/8/2009
Posts: 613
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Jiminy Christmas, what is wrong with people!  The advice you've gotten is surely the appropriate thing to do.... I'd be tempted to tell her to pound salt up her butt.  blush

Date Posted: 6/20/2011 9:23 PM ET
Member Since: 12/31/2009
Posts: 3,995
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I'd be tempted to tell her to pound salt up her butt.

That made me laugh, hard. People at work looked at me funny.

Date Posted: 6/20/2011 9:36 PM ET
Member Since: 8/16/2007
Posts: 15,186
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I would try one more time before I attempted to get the site involved, they really try not to mitigate problem swaps.I would try something like

"I am sorry that you feel that your enjoyment of the site has been hampered by this transaction, that makes two of us. Had you followed the rules of the site, this book was postable under the textbook exception and all you had to do was send a PM to get prior approval to send the book, since I did not want the book with writing in it we could have set something up to get your book to the next requester. Now, because you chose not to follow the rules of the site and just send the book, you've wasted postage money, I've got an unpostable book, and neither one of us are happy with the transaction.

You can read the requirements of the textbook exception in the Help Center by search for "swapping criteria". You can also see in the section on "the receiver says there is a problem with the book I sent" that if the problem reported is accurate the credit should be returned and the problem book does not have to be returned at the receiver's expense. Please return my original credit so that I may request a usable copy of this book and if you would like this copy back, you can send me a postage paid envelope. 

Once I have received the credit refund, I will mark the transaction as resolved in my Transaction Achive.

 If the credit has not been returned within a week of this PM, I will mark the transaction unresolved which will result in a double black mark on your account. I will also forward your previous PM in which you state you knew about the writing on to the PBS Team so that they can see you are knowingly sending out books with writing in them without prior approval by the receivers."



Last Edited on: 6/20/11 9:36 PM ET - Total times edited: 1
Date Posted: 6/20/2011 10:53 PM ET
Member Since: 12/31/2009
Posts: 3,995
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yes Melanie

Very nicely written.

Date Posted: 6/20/2011 11:12 PM ET
Member Since: 2/26/2006
Posts: 34,913
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Melanie, you're my hero.  Great response!

Date Posted: 6/21/2011 4:17 AM ET
Member Since: 8/26/2006
Posts: 9,327
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yesyesyes

Date Posted: 6/21/2011 7:22 PM ET
Member Since: 3/1/2009
Posts: 273
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Thank you Melanie! I think I will modify your comments and send it along, with hopes and fingers crossed that it will be awhile until I need to do this again!

Date Posted: 6/21/2011 7:23 PM ET
Member Since: 12/28/2006
Posts: 14,171
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I agree, great response Melanie!!