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Topic: Member demanding a credit for their error.

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Subject: Member demanding a credit for their error.
Date Posted: 6/26/2017 11:10 AM ET
Member Since: 6/10/2005
Posts: 24
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I sent an MP3 audiobook, nearly brand new using the ISBN on the back of the book. The listing clearly states that the book is in MP3 form, I just double checked. I  received this message from the member. I sent her 3 credits but I don't feel that this was my fault at all and now I am out a credit and postage and don't have the book in my hands (I did ask for it back). What do you do in these situations?

"Hello! Unfortunately, we have a problem with this transaction. You have sent me an MP3-CD book, which is not what was listed on PBS. I ordered a (regular CD) audio book. This does not play in traditional car CD players, and is therefore unusable. Sending the wrong kind of book is against PBS policy, and since I cannot play this, I request my 2 credits back. Per PBS rules, if you would like your book back (no problem), you must refund me an additional credit to cover the cost of postage for this (so, 3 credits if you want it back, 2 credits to be in compliance with PBS). If you do not refund the 2 credits, you could risk losing your PBS account. I would like the refund by the end of tomorrow (Sunday), or I will report this to PBS. Thank you for your consideration."

 

Date Posted: 6/26/2017 1:36 PM ET
Member Since: 5/16/2008
Posts: 2,167
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Hahah, I'm the member. The listing showed "Audio CD." Sorry, Laurie! That's why PBS rules show that you're supposed to check these things even if you enter it from the regular "type in the ISBN." It even makes you click an "Are you sure?" Why would you refund the credits if you thought you were right?

I think I've been here something like 9 years and this is my first wrong book. Not bad. Laurie followed the procedure and refunded the credits plus one to mail the item back. I have no doubt it'll get snapped up, it's a very sexy sounding audio MP3. Unfortunately, those just don't play in my car. I'll be getting it in the mail to her tomorrow. I'd also like to thank her for *not* responding with snark, hatred, or vitriol.

You "don't have the book in your hands" because you literally sent me your address 1 hour ago. Patience, please. I "don't have the book" (that I ordered) in my hands either, because it was input incorrectly. So, peace out a bit. Mistakes happen. Learn from it, and let it go.

 

Date Posted: 6/26/2017 2:09 PM ET
Member Since: 6/20/2007
Posts: 4,979
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Are MP3s even allowed here?

From the HC:

Allowed:

  • Paperback books
  • Hardcover books (dust jackets not required)
  • Audio books (must be originals, not burned copies) - audio CDs, audio cassettes and Playaways are allowed.

 

I see no mention of MP3s as acceptable form of audio book. 

Date Posted: 6/26/2017 2:18 PM ET
Member Since: 6/30/2007
Posts: 2,448
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MP3s are allowed.

See this recent discussion.

Subject: I am not wrong
Date Posted: 6/26/2017 2:23 PM ET
Member Since: 6/10/2005
Posts: 24
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The listing clearly states "unabridged MP3".  I think you need to learn from this and let it go. MP3's are allowed, I entered the ISBN correctly and you did not read the listing before requesting and then got upset at me. I've been here since 2005 and have never received a PM quite so rude as the one you initially sent me basically threatening to report me if I didn't reply (on a Sunday!) within 24 hours. 



Last Edited on: 6/26/17 2:25 PM ET - Total times edited: 1
Date Posted: 6/26/2017 2:37 PM ET
Member Since: 6/10/2005
Posts: 24
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Also, to answer your first question about why I gave you 3 credits knowing I was correct? I'm a decent person and you seemed very put out about the whole thing and I'd really like my book back. I figured I'd never see it again had I not given you the credits you demanded. The book, as I told you in the initial PM, is published by Tantor Media. There is NOT a CD version. The only audio version besides the Audible version are the MP3's burned onto a CD which Tantor released and which I sent you. I don't know how I can make this any more clear. 

Check at Amazon if you don't believe me. https://www.amazon.com/Emphatic-Souls-Serenade-Kaylee-Ryan/dp/1515963098/ref=sr_1_1_twi_aud_4?ie=UTF8&qid=1498501981&sr=8-1&keywords=emphatic+ryan

 

 



Last Edited on: 6/26/17 2:38 PM ET - Total times edited: 1
Date Posted: 6/26/2017 2:41 PM ET
Member Since: 5/16/2008
Posts: 2,167
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Please let it go, Laurie. You posted the entirety of my message (unless you go back and edit it). No one here is going to agree with you that what I wrote was rude. Stop fanning the flames. I put in what we're supposed to... letting the member know they made a mistake, asking for credits back, and saying that we'll appraise PBS of a bad transaction. Don't troll. As the forums state, keep it friendly.

Should you continue to get "creative," I can easily screenshot the message I sent you. It's not rude. So, stop before you make yourself look hissy. You returned the credits, so you know it was a mistake. I thanked you for it (in another super polite email I can share). You'll have your book back soon. Let it go. 

I'm gonna take this thread off "watch" because I can feel the trainwreck snowballing. This is how PBS is supposed to work, it worked, it is done.

Date Posted: 6/26/2017 2:44 PM ET
Member Since: 6/10/2005
Posts: 24
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You asked a question, I answered. You will never admit you are wrong and I have better things to do. End of conversation.

Date Posted: 6/26/2017 2:52 PM ET
Member Since: 6/20/2007
Posts: 4,979
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Is this the listing?

http://www.paperbackswap.com/Emphatic-Souls-Serenade-Kaylee-Ryan/book/1515963098/

Because if it is, it lists the book type as follows:

Book Type: Audio CD

So I don't see where the listing clearly states unabridged MP3.  

Did I reference the wrong listing? 

Just trying to learn something new here. 

Date Posted: 6/26/2017 2:56 PM ET
Member Since: 6/10/2005
Posts: 24
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That's the one. Under edition it states:

 ISBN-13: 9781515963097
ISBN-10: 1515963098
Publication Date: 2/28/2017
Edition: MP3 Una

This is the book I entered and sent. If it's anyone's fault it's the PBS database. These should not be allowed if they are going to cause such an issue.

Date Posted: 6/26/2017 3:04 PM ET
Member Since: 6/20/2007
Posts: 4,979
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I agree that the database is unclear. Reading this listing I wouldn't have ever picked up that these were CDs of MP3 files. I therefore can understand why Heather wouldn't have known it either. The listing lists the book type as Audio CD. I would've expected, with it listed as such, that I would get CDs that I could pop in my car CD player. 

Date Posted: 6/26/2017 3:18 PM ET
Member Since: 9/25/2008
Posts: 3,900
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I think the confusion came as Book Type is listed as Audio CD and the edition says MP3 Una. I would have asked the Team how to handle the situation.
ISBN-13: 9781515963097
ISBN-10: 1515963098
Publication Date: 2/28/2017
Edition: MP3 Una
Publisher: Tantor Audio

Book Type: Audio CD
Other Versions: Paperback
Members Wishing: 0

Date Posted: 6/26/2017 5:17 PM ET
Member Since: 6/2/2014
Posts: 9,347
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My .02..

This is where I feel like everyone is at fault. It does say MP3 Una and Audio CD. In this case, before doing anything else I would've contacted PBS, pointed out the listing here and Amazon.

I feel like Laurie should have contacted PBS when she saw the listing had both and then again when Heather wrote her.

I feel like Heather should also have seen the listing and how it was listed

I can see where everyone got confused with this. That being said, I don't think the wrong item was sent out. I think the fair thing is to keep the item and after contacting pbs, relist it if you don't want it. I think the credit for mailing back should be returned.

While I agree the person listing should double check, the receiver needs to double check and make sure what they have on their wl is right.

 

Edited for: I think PBS shoudl make both of you whole so neither are out credits.

I think this is how PBS might list MP3..

An ex.:

http://www.paperbackswap.com/Windup-Girl-Paolo-Bacigalupi/book/1511319909/

Also editions show abridged or unabridged so I wonder if this comes up as an issue too (Someone wants an unabridged but gets abridged because you have to check the listing.

Ex:

http://www.paperbackswap.com/Choosing-SEE-Journey-Struggle-Hope/book/0800720067/?isbn=0800720067 

http://www.paperbackswap.com/Things-Grandchildren-Know-Audio-CD/book/1433251809/

 

i think in term sof audio books the edition says alot.



Last Edited on: 6/26/17 5:27 PM ET - Total times edited: 3
Date Posted: 6/26/2017 6:11 PM ET
Member Since: 1/17/2009
Posts: 9,857
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I just want to comment that in general PBS allows 5 days to respond to PMs.

So demanding a next day response to PMs is not within the rules.

PBS does not actually get involved in transaction disputes UNLESS the sender clearly admits wrongdoing. So, when there is a dispute over a transaction, you can "report it" all you want, but PBS does not care and will not get involved in a she-said/she-said situation. 

They only care in situations where a sender clearly admits sending a damaged book but refuses to refund a credit. In cases where the sender disputes the damage they do not get involved.

Your situation with 2 contradictory audio types both in the listing might be a little bit different, as PBS does require the sender to verify that the book type is correct, and if it does say Audio CD (even in addition to MP3 CD)  it would have been better to question PBS about it, or perhaps to PM the book requestor first to seee what they thought they were ordering. 

If you do a little research and discover tha the listing is incorrect, it is possible to edit the listing yourself as well. (Changes that you make will be reviewed by a volunteer before they are committed to the database).

Date Posted: 6/26/2017 7:31 PM ET
Member Since: 4/25/2007
Posts: 11,517
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I don't find the PM overtly rude but it is pretty abrupt and threatening their PBS account over this one transaction is a bit over the top in my opinion.  It does not comer across very nicely at all.  Also, the short timeframe to respond is wrong.  Not everyone is on PBS every day.  Even PBS says to allow the other person time to respond, 5 days as Sara says above.

Since the listing itself seems to be wrong, please submit the edit to the database that this is an MP3 and not a regular CD audiobook so no one else is confused in the future.  Then, Laurie can relist the book when she gets it back and that edit is done so she can send it out to someone that wants it and knows what they're getting.  It's not on the sender to make sure the requestor knows what they're ordering as long as the listing is correct.

Date Posted: 6/26/2017 7:58 PM ET
Member Since: 6/2/2014
Posts: 9,347
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I too felt the requestor's note was threatening...and wrong.  Be nice in pms..how you would like to receive a pm is how you should send one.

 



Last Edited on: 6/26/17 7:59 PM ET - Total times edited: 1
Date Posted: 6/26/2017 9:11 PM ET
Member Since: 6/10/2005
Posts: 24
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I asked PBS directly what the deal is with MP3's and this is the official response.  "Thanks for writing in. MP3 Audio format books are permitted here. Because publishers don't always specify "MP3," that means MP3 Audios are listed with "Audio CD" booktype here. 

For that reason -- MP3 Audio books are listed as "Audio CD" and it may not be clear from the listing that the book is MP3 format-- members who can't play MP3s need to use Requestor Conditions to stipulate that.

We also do recommend that members who post MP3 Audio put "(MP3 Audio)" into the TITLE of the listing. We have done that for this listing now.

We hope this information is helpful. Have a great day,

The PaperBackSwap Team
www.PaperBackSwap.com". 

 

Too bad Heather flounced and will never see it. 

Date Posted: 6/26/2017 9:26 PM ET
Member Since: 6/20/2007
Posts: 4,979
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Laurie, earlier in this thread you wrote "End of conversation." (Eighth post in this thread.) Yet now you accuse Heather of flouncing. You said it was over, and she appears to have  respected that and ended it as you asked. That's not flouncing. 

I read through the HC and found NOTHING about MP3s. Nothing about how they're listed as audio CDs. Nothing about requiring RCs if you don't want MP3s. I've been a member a long time, am relatively active in the forums, and knew NONE of this. The only place it seems to say that MP3s are allowed is the thread referenced by Linda. IMHO having a forum thread as the only guideline on this is unacceptable on PBS's part, and I honestly think that they are to blame for a listing that's as clear as mud. 



Last Edited on: 6/26/17 9:28 PM ET - Total times edited: 1
Date Posted: 6/26/2017 9:40 PM ET
Member Since: 6/19/2008
Posts: 5,706
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 If you do not refund the 2 credits, you could risk losing your PBS account. I would like the refund by the end of tomorrow (Sunday), or I will report this to PBS.

 

That was not very nice , as everyone has said " alot of people are not on , on the weekend. and you have 5 days.. I do think PBS is at fault

 



Last Edited on: 6/26/17 9:41 PM ET - Total times edited: 1
Date Posted: 6/26/2017 9:45 PM ET
Member Since: 6/10/2005
Posts: 24
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Thanks to everyone for weighing in today. I typically send off my books and have smooth transactions and did not know how to handle such an aggressive PM. In the future, I will contact PBS directly. I do wish they'd broadcast these sorts of changes to members to avoid this kind of thing.

Date Posted: 6/26/2017 9:49 PM ET
Member Since: 6/19/2008
Posts: 5,706
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Laurie , I can see you are somewhat new to the forums, So you probably didnt know what to do and you asked for advice. I probably would not no what to do in that situation either....

Date Posted: 6/26/2017 10:33 PM ET
Member Since: 6/2/2014
Posts: 9,347
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Actually MP3 is in the help docs

PBS is for the exchange of used books across all topics of interest. paperback,hardcover and audio books in good condition are acceptable here. 


Allowed:

  • Paperback books
  • Hardcover books (dust jackets not required)
  • Audio books (must be originals, not burnedcopies) - audio CDs, audio cassettes and Playaways are allowed
    • This category includes MP3 audios. Note: MP3 Audio books at PaperBackSwap are listed with "Audio CD" booktype -- so it may not be clear from the listing that the book is MP3 format. Members who can't play MP3 audios need to use Requestor Conditions to stipulate that they do not want MP3 format books.
    • We do recommend that members whoPost MP3 Audio put "(MP3 Audio)" after the title in the listing, using the Edit Book Data option accessible from the More Options menu on the Book Details page to submit the addition

TThey are allowed and is explained. The requestor should make sure what they're requesting is what they want.

Date Posted: 6/26/2017 10:51 PM ET
Member Since: 4/6/2007
Posts: 1,404
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The majority of my trades on this site are audiobooks. An MP3 IS an audio CD, it just happens to be in MP3 format, so calling an MP3 an audio CD is NOT wrong, it is, in fact,  correct.  That being said, many do not understand this and do not research well enough to know exactly what they are ordering.  I, too, have learned this lesson the hard way and I will no longer list an audio CD in MP3 format without first editing the title to make it very, very clear that what is being ordered is the MP3 format of an audio CD, much like TPTB have edited this listing to make it more clear.  Since I began doing this, I have not had any problems with members not knowing what they were actually ordering.

Laurie - please feel free to list MP3 versions if you have them in the future - just maybe take the extra step and edit the title to include the MP3 aspect before you post it, then wait a day or two for the edit to be approved before you actually post it.  I will usually edit a title (if I need to) when I first get the MP3 book so that the edit has been approved and it's ready to go when I am finished with the book and ready to post it.  Personally, I prefer MP3 format b/c they are much less cumbersome and transfer faster to my computer for listening on my iPhone.  If given a choice, I will always order MP3 before regular CD's if both are available. 

Date Posted: 6/27/2017 7:37 PM ET
Member Since: 7/5/2007
Posts: 2,176
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I, too, felt that the requestor's wording to be very threatening.  It came across much as "give me 2 credits or I'm going to (try to) get your account suspended."  Some who do not know better would be extorted into refunding credits out of fear.

 

Someone could always PM PBS's response regarding mp3sto her.

Date Posted: 6/27/2017 11:59 PM ET
Member Since: 1/17/2009
Posts: 9,857
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Laurie, given the rule, it seems like you could contact Heather and ask for your credits back, as the RWAP was made in error. Or contact PBS and ask them to contact her.

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