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Topic: People posting ARCs!!!

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Subject: People posting ARCs!!!
Date Posted: 8/4/2009 3:07 PM ET
Member Since: 3/13/2007
Posts: 3,773
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arrgh, i swear this keeps happening to me. this is the 3rd time this year, i've had someone post a book to me that does not come out for months (and i mean like 5-6 months) in advance so obviously they have an ARC. i've pmed them just to confirm this in case. i know if it is, then i have to accept, they cancel for me to get back in line at no. 1.

but what if they dont' reply to my PM? do i still accept and hope that it times out? if i say no, i'll be back at the bottom. i know i could let TPTB know, is that the only other way besides doing that?

Date Posted: 8/4/2009 3:37 PM ET
Member Since: 12/28/2006
Posts: 14,171
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Yeah 5 or 6 months makes an ARC very likely. 

Ummm strategy...send a copy of your pm to TPTB? Dunno what else can be done yet. To not accept looses your wishlist position.  But,  I would feel antsy having to trust the other member to cancel the transaction once you accept.  If you accept and later mark the transaction RWAP, don't you regain your former wishlist position?  There is the credit problem tho :-(  On top of the general hastle factor, there is no guarantee your credit will be returned. 

Here's an idea for TPTB...would it be difficult to tie a pop up window to the release date of each book?  Members that post a book several weeks prior to the release date could get an additional window --- reminding them that ARC's are unpostable, and a button confirming that their book is not an ARC, before completing the book posting??

ETA - how about an RC reminder that ARC's are unpostable?  But then, some members automatically reject all RC's which could cost you legit books.



Last Edited on: 8/4/09 3:39 PM ET - Total times edited: 1
Date Posted: 8/4/2009 3:58 PM ET
Member Since: 5/14/2009
Posts: 6,852
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Or they should have a pop up that says you can post ARCs for a credit in the BB.  There is a ARC thread that members can post and request a credit.

Date Posted: 8/4/2009 3:58 PM ET
Member Since: 5/16/2008
Posts: 2,146
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Deborah- I'm sorry this is happening but it's cool you're smart enough to figure it out. Me, I'm so excited to see "WISH GRANTED" that I can barely click fast enough on "Yes I want this book." It won't be much comfort, but if the person doesn't respond and does mail you the book, when you click RWAP, you go back to the front of the line (or whatever place you were). For some people, that gets them angsty b/c it means that in the month or so (however long it took for them to get the book), other people may have gotten the book or moved up. But since your book hasn't come out, no one is beating you to the books/front of the line. I know you probably will lose the credit unless the person returns it to you, but if it's a heavily WL book, you may be able to turn the ARC around for a credit (I know I'm always happy to get a WL ARC). It's not the best situation but at least you will remain first in line and probably be able to get a credit for the book too.

I'll hold out hope that the person realizes their error before you get wrapped up in it.

Oh, as for Fangirl's suggestion of an ARC RC (haha)- my gut says the people who post ARCs knowingly and then refuse to return the credit will bypass this anyway. It's the people who don't KNOW what an ARC is are the ones it could help. But if Deborah's situation is someone who is like, "Yeah, I know the rules, and I don't care" they're going to accept the RC anyway



Last Edited on: 8/4/09 4:00 PM ET - Total times edited: 1
Date Posted: 8/4/2009 6:31 PM ET
Member Since: 1/17/2009
Posts: 9,720
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I'm just offering this up as a possibility ... every instance of an earlier than expected WL offer might not be an ARC.

Books can be released in the UK earlier than they are in the US (or vice versa) ... and if you are like me, for some books, you just go Wish List every ISBN for a particular book .... you could be Wish Listing a UK version of the book that might already be released.

Now, granted, it is probably not all that common for tons of UK ISBNs to get posted here .... but its not impossible, either. I buy lots of books out of country as I'm traveling, I assume other people do it too ...

Date Posted: 8/4/2009 7:39 PM ET
Member Since: 8/10/2005
Posts: 4,599
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Personally speaking, I would PM but if they don't reply, accept the offer. If they catch it in time, they can cancel. If they never respond and just send it, when you get it, mark it RWAP. If it's 5-6 months before the real release, you should still be back to your place in line in plenty of time to get a real copy.

I had this happen recently--before I could PM though, the person sent ME a PM saying "Nice brand new softcover copy." LOL DUH! Hello...it's the hardcover that's wishlisted and its not due out for months! Must be an ARC....I explained abou tthem not being postable, but he had already marked it mailed (although he hadn't actually mailed it) and had to get PBS to cancel the request so I could go back to my spot in the line.

There are lots more places where ARCs are available to the general public these days so it's not likely to become LESS of a problem, I don't think.

Cheryl

Date Posted: 8/4/2009 7:55 PM ET
Member Since: 4/25/2007
Posts: 11,460
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I had a pre-order in for a book last year on Barnes & Noble.com.  They did end up sending me the book a couple of weeks before the release date.  Not months though!  So, I had a legit non-ARC copy about 2 weeks before release date.  4-5 months though, that's obviously an ARC.

Subject: Why are ARCs against the rules?
Date Posted: 8/4/2009 9:38 PM ET
Member Since: 7/27/2009
Posts: 1
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Forgive me for asking, but I'm new here. Why are ARCs not okay? I'd be happy to get one.

Date Posted: 8/4/2009 9:47 PM ET
Member Since: 7/18/2009
Posts: 60
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B/c they tend to have the same ISBN as the first official print, they can easily confuse a requester. This is bad b/c ARCs cannot be depended upon to contain the same story/text as the published book.



Last Edited on: 8/4/09 9:47 PM ET - Total times edited: 1
Date Posted: 8/4/2009 10:49 PM ET
Member Since: 4/25/2007
Posts: 11,460
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You can post in the Book Bazaar forum that you have an ARC and you can ask for a credit for it.  You can't put it on your PBS shelf though.

Here's what the help dos say about ARCs:

An ARC  (Advanced Reader Copy)  is an advance release of a book, usually sent to reviewers before the final copy of the book is published.

  • Advance Reader Copies are also known as Review Copies, or Uncorrected Proofs.
  • They are softcover books and often carry the same ISBN as the hardcover first-edition that is released later.
  • On the cover, they will be marked 'Advanced Reader Copy' or 'Uncorrected Proof' or 'Review Copy' and will usually also say 'Not for Sale'.

ARCs cannot be Posted to a PBS Bookshelf for swapping, since the ARC cannot be depended upon to contain the same story/text as the published book.

  • If you send an ARC, the requestor will probably contact you to ask for the credit back.
    • You will need to do this.
    • You are asked to confirm for each book you Post that it is not an ARC.  If you posted an ARC you broke the rules. 
  • If you receive an ARC, you should mark it received as a Wrong Book and send a message to the sender asking for your credit back.
    • You should NOT repost an ARC (or any problem book) if you receive one.
  • The receiver of an ARC is not required to return the item; she or he may agree to do so if the sender sends postage for the item's return.  This is the case with all problem books: the requestor receiving them is not obligated to spend postage to return them.


Last Edited on: 8/4/09 10:49 PM ET - Total times edited: 1
Cathy A. (Cathy) - ,
Date Posted: 8/5/2009 10:14 AM ET
Member Since: 12/27/2005
Posts: 4,124
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The best thing to do is to accept the offer just before you send the PM asking if it's an ARC. There's no reason to wait for an answer to that question before accepting the offer. If it is an ARC, then you have to accept so she can cancel. If it's not an ARC, then you have to accept the offer to get the book. So since you are going to accept the offer either way, just do it up front.

That way she can cancel immediately after seeing your PM instead of having to reply to your first PM, then wait for you to login and accept, then remember which transaction she was supposed to cancel and do that correctly ... there are just too many possibilities for confusion and errors in any situation that requires multiple back and forth PMs.

Once you accept the WL offer, the request goes into 1 hr buyer's remorse hold, so you have an hour to compose your PM and send it before she can even see the request. I would give explicit instructions on how to recognize if this book is an ARC and how to cancel the transaction if it is (i.e. click "I Cannot Mail", not "My Book Does Not Meet Requestor Conditions").

Date Posted: 8/6/2009 2:36 AM ET
Member Since: 12/28/2006
Posts: 14,171
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Cathy, ARC's are not guaranteed to be the final edition released, as there may be some late edits.  They may be offered in the Book Bazaar for credit or as freebies, but must NOT be posted FIFO.

Date Posted: 8/6/2009 7:50 AM ET
Member Since: 1/31/2006
Posts: 1,402
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Although I am not saying this is the case here, it is possible to have early releases.  I review books for a few publishing houses and right now I have about half a dozen books (not ARCs)  that won't be released for sale until between late OCT and early FEB.  Granted, only about one in twenty that I receive early is not an ARC.  But I do get them.  I usually hold them until the release date to avoid this sort of confusion, but if I really needed the credit I might post it early.

Date Posted: 8/6/2009 9:35 AM ET
Member Since: 8/10/2005
Posts: 4,599
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Meghan, are those books the regular hardcover version that will be released later? Or a softcover? I've never gotten an early release more than a month or two in advance, and usually they are a softcover version of the hardcover that will be released, even though they aren't an ARC. I don't think I've ever gotten a hardcover early release, not that I can remember anyway.

Cheryl

Cathy A. (Cathy) - ,
Date Posted: 8/6/2009 9:43 AM ET
Member Since: 12/27/2005
Posts: 4,124
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Cathy, ARC's are not guaranteed to be the final edition released, as there may be some late edits.  They may be offered in the Book Bazaar for credit or as freebies, but must NOT be posted FIFO.

 

Yes Denise, I totally understand that. I am trying to help Deborah, the OP, who thinks someone else might already have posted an ARC that's on her wish list. Given that she has a wish list offer on her My Account page, Deborah should accept that offer. She can figure out whether it's really an ARC or not and have it canceled if it is after accepting.

 



Last Edited on: 8/6/09 9:44 AM ET - Total times edited: 2
Date Posted: 8/6/2009 10:24 AM ET
Member Since: 1/31/2006
Posts: 1,402
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Cheryl, 3 are HBs (one due for release the end of this year, the other two early next) and 2 are Trade PBs (one previously in HB and one not, and they are due for release in late OCT and early NOV.) 

My purpose in replying was that earleir in the thread, someone stated that the book in question had to be an ARC and I merely wanted to point out the fact that while it is likely to be an ARC, there is the possiblilty that it is not. 

FWIW,  This year is the first that I've rcd early HBs, either I've worked my way up the list or it's less expensive than printing out ARCs in some instances.  I haven't asked.  Also (having checked the books) it's only one publisher that is doing it.  I review a large number of books (this year alone I'm over 150, though this is higher than previous years) and the majority of them are ARCs.  I get between one and three a month that are early releases of trade PBs.   Most of my pre-release non-ARCs come 4 to 6 weeks in advance, just long enough to get reviews in for the release date and they are usually Trade PBs.  Occasionally, I get them earlier and more rarely, they are HBs.  As a side note, my early HBs have never come with DJs.  Also, the majority of my reviewing is done for publishing houses and they tend to get copies out much earlier.  I sometimes receive a book to review from a magazine or website months after I've reviewed for the publisher.

ed b/c for some reason this didn't format properly...



Last Edited on: 8/6/09 10:26 AM ET - Total times edited: 2