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Topic: postability: reply

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Subject: postability: reply
Date Posted: 11/7/2012 8:11 PM ET
Member Since: 2/11/2011
Posts: 2,872
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I got a book from a game.  I just now sat down to start reading it because I planned on shipping it in a big order to someone.  It is a wishilst book. I sit down to read it and 1/3 to 1/2 of the 1st few pages have ripped from the bottom.  (are ripping upwards). And it does this everytime I turn a page.  Is this unpostable?

I am reading this book like its fragile and I turne one page and it rips upwards.

 

Is there any way to repair this?



Last Edited on: 11/18/12 10:27 AM ET - Total times edited: 1
Date Posted: 11/7/2012 9:06 PM ET
Member Since: 8/19/2007
Posts: 4,243
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I don't have an answer for you, but I'm interested in seeing what others say.  I've had this happen on books, and just chalked it up to bad binding, and figured it was unpostable.  Pat

Date Posted: 11/7/2012 9:08 PM ET
Member Since: 2/11/2011
Posts: 2,872
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The book just fell apart in my hands. I tried to tape some pages back together and it just came apart.   I didn't think anything of it because the book looked brand new. So many pages came out I had to throw it away. I just don't have the patience to try and salvage it for one last good read. 



Last Edited on: 11/7/12 9:49 PM ET - Total times edited: 4
Date Posted: 11/7/2012 9:34 PM ET
Member Since: 6/24/2012
Posts: 1,482
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That totally sux Jamie. frown

Date Posted: 11/7/2012 9:39 PM ET
Member Since: 12/28/2006
Posts: 14,171
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Yes, pages seperating from the binding make a book unpostable.  Unfortunately sometimes the glue is at fault, especially older glue.  The book may appear fine when the other member mailed it to you, but being flexed and manhandled in the sorting facilities may crack brittle glue...therefore causing the pages to quickly detatch upon being opened  on the other end of the journey. 

This is one reason it's important to inspect books carefully when they are received.   It doesn't happen often, but it does happen...most members that swap many books have been in your shoes at one time or another.  I've swapped around a thousand books and have only seen this a couple times.

Awhile back somebody posted a video link about how USPS (UPS & FedEx too) processes mail, I'll repost the link.  The last third shows package sorting.  And keep in mind, this is under ideal circumstances...it doesn't show malfunctions or equipment jams or failures.

Date Posted: 11/7/2012 9:49 PM ET
Member Since: 2/11/2011
Posts: 2,872
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The person that sent it apologized and sent me a credit. She probably didn't have to but she was nice enough too.  I just really really wanted to read this book.  Was dissapointed that that happens.  But as the sayings goes stuff happens. 

Date Posted: 11/7/2012 10:37 PM ET
Member Since: 8/19/2007
Posts: 4,243
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I've had it happen to fairly new books also, and sometimes if you're really careful, it will only separate about 10 or so pages, but then the book is still unpostable.  Sorry this happened.  Pat

Date Posted: 11/8/2012 4:11 AM ET
Member Since: 1/17/2009
Posts: 9,727
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From what you described, it sounds sort of like the book was postable when it was mailed .... and started coming apart as you were reading it. The credit returned to you is between you and the sender ... however, it doesn't sound like the book was unpostable when she sent it. I probably wouldn't have taken the credit.

However, sometimes bindings like that where pages are just sort of falling out can be repaired with an iron. First, fit the pages back into the book as perfect as you can get them ... right up against the glue of the binding is best. Then heat up your iron, cover the spine with a washcloth or paper towel or something (so it doesn't burn AND so you won't get melted glue on your iron) and use the iron on the spine to remelt the glue.

I haven't posted any that I've fixed this way (yet) ... but I fixed some that were keepers, because I wanted to see how well it would work ... and I was able to read the repaired books normally after the repair, and the repairs held up.  If I didn't know they were repaired, I would not be able to tell, and the books do not seem any more fragile to me. I tugged gently on the pages that were previously falling out and they now seem firmly attached.



Last Edited on: 11/8/12 4:14 AM ET - Total times edited: 2
Date Posted: 11/8/2012 5:55 PM ET
Member Since: 5/18/2007
Posts: 13,188
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Books in games operate under different guidelines when it comes to recouping losses. If you receive an unpostable book you're supposed to contact the hostess before contacting the player who sent you a book. You are not, under any circumstances, supposed to contact the sender first. It's a rule that was put into place because there were a lot of issues causing many problems. 

I have no idea how long ago this was but, if you don't want to contact the hostess,  I would at least get a hold of the GM so she can contact the hostess to let her know what happened. That is covering your butt!

Date Posted: 11/8/2012 7:02 PM ET
Member Since: 10/13/2010
Posts: 4,314
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Not sure about the games & how they work, but it sounds like the book was probably in postable condition when you received it & unfortunately it fell apart as you read it.  I've had books do that to me & it's always a bummer when you can't repost them.

Date Posted: 11/9/2012 8:55 AM ET
Member Since: 6/24/2012
Posts: 1,482
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Sara, how long has your glue fix held up so far? 

Date Posted: 11/9/2012 9:12 AM ET
Member Since: 1/17/2009
Posts: 9,727
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About a year so far.

Date Posted: 11/9/2012 10:32 AM ET
Member Since: 8/16/2007
Posts: 15,186
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If you didn't inspect the book when you got it and its sat for a while or it appears to be happening while you use the book, not something that as there before it was mailed to you, I wouldn't contact a Game Mod about it as it doesn't sound like you could say the sender definitely sent an unpostable book, only that it is becoming unpostable as you use it.

I have had a book's page come out as I turned them. It looked like someone had used an oil based glue to repair or reinforce the spine at some point because the "glue" looked more like oil than glue as the book started to fall apart. 

I've repaired broken/separated spines by reheating them with an iron. I have not had any re-separate on me. I have never done one that was severe enough to have the pages coming out though, only cracks or separation. I don't think it would work on a book that far gone that the pages are falling out. You'd never get the pages back in the right spot.

Date Posted: 11/9/2012 7:47 PM ET
Member Since: 5/18/2007
Posts: 13,188
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If you didn't inspect the book when you got it and its sat for a while or it appears to be happening while you use the book, not something that as there before it was mailed to you, I wouldn't contact a Game Mod about it as it doesn't sound like you could say the sender definitely sent an unpostable book, only that it is becoming unpostable as you use it.

I disagree. She already contacted the sender, another game player, and got a credit returned. That is symbolic of the fact that she and the sender found the sender at fault. That is in direct violation of game rules, Melanie. Given that she did that, she really needs to contact the GM or the hostess. I don't recognize you as a game player so perhaps you're not aware that under no  circumstances are you supposed to contact the sender of the book before the hostess. The hostess takes care of the problem initially WITH the GM, not the players. 

She is in DIRECT violation of the rules and could be penalized for it should the other person decide to take issue. She needs let Karen know what happened so it doesn't come back to maybe bite her in the butt. 

At the very least, the person she contacted should have contacted the hostess. That's in the rules as well -- in cases such as this when the receiver doesn't contact the hostess, the sender is supposed to. The players don't handle it on their own.

ETA: Here is the game rule posted from Jamie's first swap. It is the standard rule:

 

  1. If there is any problem with the book or items you receive, you must notify your host. The host and the mod will work out a solution for all parties involved.  The mods are trying to keep track of players who habitually send unpostable books.


Last Edited on: 11/9/12 8:26 PM ET - Total times edited: 3
Date Posted: 11/11/2012 9:54 PM ET
Member Since: 7/17/2010
Posts: 6,639
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Last Edited on: 11/11/12 10:26 PM ET - Total times edited: 1
Date Posted: 11/12/2012 4:38 PM ET
Member Since: 6/20/2009
Posts: 5,829
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I find this whole convo so interesting!

I think that there was no need to contact the mods for Jamie's situation. As she said, she didn't receive the book as unpostable. As she started reading it, the pages started falling out. The fact that she let the sender know and the sender sent her a credit does not indicate that the sender was at fault. It meant that the sender was nice enough and compasionate enough to give a credit.

Case in point: I have RC's about books that are from smokers' homes because of my allergies. My nose is extremely sensitive. I received a book from a member (that i know doesn't smoke) and it had a smokey smell to me. I let her know so that she could check her books for future possible trades. Her nose is not as sensitive and she had received that book from another trade and didn't detect a smell. However, she sent me a credit anyway simply because she felt smpathy for the situation. Was she at fault? NO. It was just a kindness.

Sometimes things happen that we have no control over. And it ends up being the generosity of others that help us not take things so seriously.

Jamie and/or the sender are not in violation of the rules since the book was received in postable condition. Due to PO handling or binding or whatever, the pages started falling or fell out during reading.

My opinion.

Date Posted: 11/12/2012 4:54 PM ET
Member Since: 1/17/2009
Posts: 9,727
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Jamie and/or the sender are not in violation of the rules since the book was received in postable condition. Due to PO handling or binding or whatever, the pages started falling or fell out during reading.

They actually are in violation of the game rules. Jaime reported an issue to the person who sent the book, and then accepted a credit as a resolution. That's in violation of the game moderator's rules. All issues with game books and resolutions (if needed) are to go thru game moderators. There are no exceptions.

I'm NOT saying that this situation occurred here ... but my understanding of the reason for the rule is that the games moderators need to keep track of game players who may be abusing the system by "working out" unpostable books with the other player in the game ... for every game they play in.

Since there is no RWAP for games books, the only way to stop players who may be abusing the good will of other players is for the moderators to track each and every unpostable game book transacted ... therefore they will know if there are any players who either keep mailing, or keep receiving unpostable games books.

I missed the games aspect in my first answer ... but the rest of the posters are absolutely correct, this problem should have been reported to the game moderator of the game that the OP played in.

Date Posted: 11/12/2012 6:51 PM ET
Member Since: 8/16/2007
Posts: 15,186
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She already contacted the sender, another game player, and got a credit returned. That is symbolic of the fact that she and the sender found the sender at fault. That is in direct violation of game rules, Melanie. Given that she did that, she really needs to contact the GM or the hostess. I don't recognize you as a game player so perhaps you're not aware that under no  circumstances are you supposed to contact the sender of the book before the hostess. The hostess takes care of the problem initially WITH the GM, not the players. 

I am a game player and am aware of the rules. I did not see the post saying that she got a credit back from the other member, I agree that she must notify the hostess of that. My response was in reference to the condition of the book, I don't think it warranted contacting the hostess in the first place if she got a postable book where she was the last read. Now that she has talked to the other member about the problem and gotten a credit for it, yes she needs to tell her hostess what she did.

Date Posted: 11/12/2012 7:03 PM ET
Member Since: 7/17/2010
Posts: 6,639
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Well...at first I commented...then erased it. But I will comment again.

I AM THE PERSON that sent Jamie the book. It was in very good condition when I mailed it to her. I have NEVER ...EVER sent a book that was not postable in the close to 1000 I have mailed and all the games I have played in. And I often have "repeat customers" because my books are usually in like new condition and they appreciate that.

When Jamie contacted me about the pages lifting as she was reading, I was suprised as it was in great condition when I sent it.  BUT  Having given credits to people who need them for wl books that came up but they were out of credits...or who need them to play a game...my initial response was to offer a credit because it was a nice thing to do.  She said it wasn't necessary.  I sent it anyways. 

Sending the credit was not an admission on my part of "being at fault" or a resolution...I was being nice.

I sent the game host a message to let  her know what happened after seing all these messages and thinking GOOD GRIEF!!! 

Now I'm sure these comments were not personal ...but my squirrel is sensitive and I had to say something for him. 

The squirrel is going back to his nuts now

Date Posted: 11/12/2012 7:43 PM ET
Member Since: 5/18/2007
Posts: 13,188
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but my squirrel is sensitive and I had to say something for him. 

Not sure why, no one had any clue it was you. At least I certainly didn't. I think it would have been better with at least one of the parties remaining anonymous (friends come to protect friends and it becomes a needless pile on ...) but since it's now playing out here with both parties known ... 

If you have an issue with what I said, I was simply saying that since a credit exchanged hands then the hostess, and/or, the GM needs to know. 

A credit never should have changed hands without letting the hostess know. The players don't ultimately choose the course of action. To me that's simply the bottom line ... not who's guilty or not guilty of whatever.  

Sending the credit was not an admission on my part of "being at fault" or a resolution...I was being nice.

That's why I used the word "symbolic." No one said the other person was absolutely "at fault." Returning a credit is symbolic of righting a perceived wrong ... whether you feel you are guilty or not. It's done all the time on here to keep the peace and be nice. In this case, it should not have been done. 

As she started reading it, the pages started falling out. The fact that she let the sender know and the sender sent her a credit does not indicate that the sender was at fault.

 

The sender is not her first point of contact though. She's supposed to contact the hostess. It really doesn't matter if the sender is at fault or not ... as Sarah said, the receiver accepted a credit for the faulty book. That changes the dynamics of the situation. I remember when all the poop hit the fan regarding a few issues with a few players. They're not random rules simply created "just because." They were created because of bonafide issues that occurred.

Case in point: I have RC's about books that are from smokers' homes because of my allergies.

To me, apples and oranges. The rules change since it's a game. Game rules need to be followed, not PBS swap rules.

Due to PO handling or binding or whatever, the pages started falling or fell out during reading.

Again, it doesn't really matter anymore. The dynamics changed when Jamie accepted a credit from Manda. 

And besides, no one knows where the damage happened. Reread Jamie's OP. She doesn't reach a conclusion so none of us really can. Since I "know" Manda, and have received books from her, I'd err on the side of it being a faulty binding or what have you but if all the parties were unknown to each other, it's not a conclusion that could be reached. 

Bottom line again, gamers are not allowed to take care of "unpostable" issues by themselves. Always contact the hostess first. 

 

 



Last Edited on: 11/12/12 7:52 PM ET - Total times edited: 3
Date Posted: 11/12/2012 8:05 PM ET
Member Since: 7/17/2010
Posts: 6,639
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I think it would have been better with at least one of the parties remaining anonymous

and you are entitled to your opinion

 

Date Posted: 11/12/2012 8:45 PM ET
Member Since: 6/20/2009
Posts: 5,829
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Again: RECEIVED AS POSTABLE.

Said what I had to say. As Manda stated: You (everyone) is entitled to your opinion. Opinions are like . . .everyone has one. Including myself.

Apples and oranges, huh, Susan? Mega-funny.

 



Last Edited on: 11/12/12 9:10 PM ET - Total times edited: 1
Date Posted: 11/12/2012 10:19 PM ET
Member Since: 5/18/2007
Posts: 13,188
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and you are entitled to your opinion

Said what I had to say. As Manda stated: You (everyone) is entitled to your opinion. Opinions are like . . .everyone has one. Including myself.

Apples and oranges, huh, Susan? Mega-funny.

Manda and Shronda,

I'm sorry you don't like my answers. All I did was repeat the rules in the games in a post that was previously more or less anonymous. What I said really isn't an opinion. It's in black and white in every, single game that is played. 

ETA: I think you both are taking this way too personally. There was no ill will meant on my end. This is why it's best not to know who the posts are about. I don't know why that bit of advice upset both of you. It was passed on to me from someone here about 5 years ago -- I think it's good advice. 

 



Last Edited on: 11/13/12 12:48 AM ET - Total times edited: 4
Date Posted: 11/12/2012 11:31 PM ET
Member Since: 12/28/2006
Posts: 14,171
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Instead of a gentle reminder of the swap rules....Susan (as usual) wades in bludgeoning everyone and everything in sight   blush

You are correct to note the swap/game connection Susan, your delivery could use some improvement.  Why use a baseball bat when a Q-tip would have worked?



Last Edited on: 11/12/12 11:36 PM ET - Total times edited: 2
Date Posted: 11/12/2012 11:55 PM ET
Member Since: 5/18/2007
Posts: 13,188
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Instead of a gentle reminder of the swap rules....Susan (as usual) wades in bludgeoning everyone and everything in sight   blush

You are correct to note the swap/game connection Susan, your delivery could use some improvement.  Why use a baseball bat when a Q-tip would have worked?

My delivery is very direct, no doubt about that. What part do you take offense to? I honestly don't see it but then that means nothing. I can't help but think your comment here though is retaliation for you being asked numerous times by several of us on the other forum to validate your statements, such as Idaho is a hotbed of inbreeding. We're still waiting. I'm pretty sure you coming here and posting, had nothing to do with you wanting to help the OP. It's really unnecessary. You should be over in the other forum answering to the many people who are having a hard time understanding your consistent misinformation in your variety of wide-flung statements. 

And if I insulted anyone with my delivery, my apologies. blush

 

 



Last Edited on: 11/13/12 12:07 AM ET - Total times edited: 2
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