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Topic: RWAP or suck it up?

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Subject: RWAP or suck it up?
Date Posted: 9/4/2009 2:14 PM ET
Member Since: 8/18/2009
Posts: 375
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So I received my first "bad" book today (this is my 4th book overall - been a member about 3 weeks).  It is a paperback with obvious liquid damage that caused discoloration on many of the pages and some "waviness".  It is readable, but I will not feel comfortable relisting it and one of the reasons I ordered it at this time is because there are only a couple copies in the system so I knew I could repost it and get a credit fairly quickly.  So, what do I do now? As I understand I can list it as a RWAP which seems like a bit of trouble - do I have to send it back? Or should I just accept it quietly and eat the potential credit? Or should I accept it but PM the sender that I am not happy and would appreciate her not posting something in that condition in the future?  I don't want to cause trouble or make enemies this early into things, but I am disappointed.  Suggestions?  Anyone else had to deal with this?

Date Posted: 9/4/2009 2:21 PM ET
Member Since: 6/25/2007
Posts: 5,637
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Sorry you got a bad book  :( Definitely RWAP. Water damage is against the rules. The book never should have been posted. Personally, I'd also ask for my credit back, but it's up to you if you want to ask for a refund. The sender is not obligated to return it.  If the sender wants the book back, they should give you anextra credit to cover postage or pay for the postage themselves. You're not obligated to send it back.

Here is a link to the Help Center article on what to when you receive a book with a problem: http://www.paperbackswap.com/help/help_item.php?id=529



Last Edited on: 9/4/09 2:23 PM ET - Total times edited: 2
Date Posted: 9/4/2009 2:35 PM ET
Member Since: 7/31/2007
Posts: 2,693
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I'd mark it RWAP (it is your PBS good citizen thing to do) and send a note to the sender....something along the lines...

Dear Sender, thanks for sending "(insert name of book)" book to be so promptly but, I'm sorry I did have to mark this book RWAP because of obvious liquid damage that caused discoloration on many of the pages and some "waviness."  I would like to request that my credit be returned and upon receipt I will promptly mark the issue resolved.  If you desire that the book be returned I will need you to send an additional credit to cover the cost of postage as outlined in the Help Center.  Thanks (signed by you)

p.s.  if I don't receive my credit within 7 days I will mark this issue unresolved and contact TPTB.

Date Posted: 9/4/2009 2:39 PM ET
Member Since: 5/14/2009
Posts: 6,852
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Welcome to PBS!

I am with Janell  and  Christy on this.  It should never have been posted and you shouldn't post it knowing it does not meet PBS standards.  If the sender requests the book back they need to send you two credits.  1 for the refund and 1 for the cost to mail the book back.  You are not going to make enemies.  Just be polite in your correspondence explain the damage and ask for the credit back.

The sender is not obligated to return your credit.  If not then you can mark the RWAP unresolved and that will go against her account.  If she repeats this practice it will be red flagged by PBS.  If she doesn't respond to your PM (give it a week especially with the holiday's) then I would contact PBS because that is not acceptable practice not to communicate in regards to a swap.  They will not get involved with the swap itself, but they should know if the member is not working with you to resolve.  That would count as two marks against her - if she doesn't communicate - but give her some time to respond.

Please, don't confuse wavieness with water damage.  Water damage will cause the paper to become kind of brittle, bumpy and the texture of the paper changes and of course staining.  The newer books have waiveness to it but it is uniformed and the texture of the paper doesn't change.

Sorry this happened so early in your membership.

edited to add Chrissy too since she beat me at the post :)



Last Edited on: 9/4/09 2:40 PM ET - Total times edited: 2
Date Posted: 9/4/2009 2:40 PM ET
Member Since: 8/18/2009
Posts: 375
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Thanks for the help guys.  I will RWAP - just needed that reassuarance that I wasn't being unreasonable since this is the first time I have had an issue.

Date Posted: 9/4/2009 2:46 PM ET
Member Since: 8/23/2007
Posts: 26,510
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Marking books RWAP is the only way to get bad senders out of PBS.  If it was just a mistake by a normally good swapper then it won't damage their account. But if they habitually send out bad books then RWPs help notify PBS of this bad habit and helps get rid of them.

Date Posted: 9/4/2009 3:43 PM ET
Member Since: 12/28/2006
Posts: 14,177
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RWAP - posting guidelines clearly state "no liquid damage of any kind".

Nice post Christy!

Date Posted: 9/4/2009 5:53 PM ET
Member Since: 12/9/2007
Posts: 9,601
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My only suggestion would be to reference the posting conditions that PBS has in the PM.

Ruth

Date Posted: 9/4/2009 10:49 PM ET
Member Since: 9/19/2008
Posts: 1
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Unless the book is really BAD suck it up. This is a used book service not a new book service. If you want a perfect book, than buy it new. I have received slightly damaged books, but I just chalk it up to a well read, well read book. I recently received a book that was -- I would not even say wavy, but paperbacks especially the big paperbacks, have a tendency to get little worn looking. I accepted and did not think anything of it. I read it and several days later send it to a requester and got a nasty email indicated it was water damaged. I think that took a lot of nerve. AGAIN these are used books we are getting for about $2.50 for a $14.00. You need to be REALISTIC!!!
Date Posted: 9/4/2009 11:34 PM ET
Member Since: 7/29/2009
Posts: 57
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She wasn't expecting a new book but a book that met the site guidelines for posting.  Water damage is clearly against the posting guidelines and in that case, the book shouldn't have been posted.  The discoloration makes it unpostable, and there's nothing unrealistic about expecting a book in postable condition.

Date Posted: 9/4/2009 11:48 PM ET
Member Since: 7/20/2007
Posts: 1,046
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There's a difference between some wavy pages from humidity and liquid damage. No one should have to accept with no problem a book with liquid damage unless they ordered an unostable with another order and KNEW that's what they were getting. I have gotten books that cost over 20 dollars in the mail with water damage, but the original cost of the book is a moot point when the rules state that those books are not acceptable on this site. There are other sites which have more lenient standards for their books, you can feel free to post your books there.

Do we expect perfect books? No. All we ask is they meet site standards. I personally think it takes 'a lot of nerve' to post a book you know doesn't meet the conditions that PBS deems postable and then act butthurt when someone doesn't accept it in that condition.

Date Posted: 9/5/2009 12:31 AM ET
Member Since: 12/9/2007
Posts: 9,601
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KAren -"really BAD" isn't the question.  the question is can bookswith liquid damage - any amount of liquid damage - postable.  It is not.  It should be RWAP and credit requested to be returned.  The postibility  guidelines are there for a reason.  Marking a RWAP is the quality control that PBS has in place.  The receivers are the quality control personnel.  No one should be encouraged by allowing them to post anything that is just readable.  This is the only way PBS can retain a high quality of used books.  No one said they had to be perfect. 

Ruth

Date Posted: 9/5/2009 1:13 AM ET
Member Since: 2/5/2007
Posts: 30,800
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Realistic is expecting books that meet the site guidelines and marking them RWAP when you don't.

Date Posted: 9/5/2009 4:18 AM ET
Member Since: 7/19/2008
Posts: 15,476
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I have no hesitation to RWAP.  I'll hesitate before marking it unresolved.  I'll even hesitate before asking for my credit.  But water damage and questionable stains, those I'll ask for the credit.  What the site watches for is repeats and patterns.  So by either entering comments or RWAP, we give TPTB more info to track problem traders.

Don't suck it up. 

Date Posted: 9/5/2009 11:21 AM ET
Member Since: 8/18/2009
Posts: 375
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Thanks everyone!  I did RWAP and asked for my credit back in a polite PM much like Christy suggested.  I don't expect books coming to me to be perfect, and I accept that my standards for sending a book out may be higher than the PBS guidelines - if I receive a book that is worn and seems to be at the end of its postable life I will gladly suck it up because I would not feel comfortable sending it on.  However this particular book obviously had either coffee or cola spilled on it.  The cover and top 1/3 of the book have brown discoloration and liquid damage on parts of the page.  This obviously could not have happened in the mailing process especially since the sender was nice enough to wrap the book in plastic.  After reading the responses here and reviewing the posting guidelines it is clear that this book should never have been posted and therefore I should not be the one to be penalized a credit.  Again, thanks for the help - now all I can do is wait and hope for positive resolution.  If not, at least I know that I lived up to my side of the PBS contract.

Date Posted: 9/5/2009 3:58 PM ET
Member Since: 11/14/2005
Posts: 6,421
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You might want to note to the sender, that "unresolved" RWAPs count like double black marks. PBS is expecting the sender to do the right thing, and when they don't then the requestor can mark the transaction "unresolved" and if their account should ever come under scrutiny, that transaction will weigh heavier than resolved ones.

Sorry, didn't read the other posts clearly enough, this point was already made :)



Last Edited on: 9/5/09 3:59 PM ET - Total times edited: 1
Date Posted: 9/5/2009 5:10 PM ET
Member Since: 9/22/2007
Posts: 187
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I really like the extra "reminder" about book condition that pops up as we finish posting books but find it odd that I seem to be receiving more against-the-posting-rules books than ever before.  Used to be that I got one only occasionally but now it seems to happen fairly often.  No correlation I'm sure but I do wish people would read the rules and abide by them.  Frustrating to say the least.....

Date Posted: 9/5/2009 7:36 PM ET
Member Since: 2/24/2009
Posts: 160
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I got a book today that probably should have been marked RWAP.  The person who sent it didnt quite get it sealed shut and hadnt wrapped it in plastic and it got wet in the mail.  Bummer.  I wont be able to repost it but I didnt want to mark it RWAP because to me it was an accident.  You could tell it happened in the mail because the book was still kind of damp.  Stuff happens.  I was happy to get it so quickly as Ive wanted to read it for awhile.



Last Edited on: 9/5/09 7:36 PM ET - Total times edited: 1
Subject: RWAP
Date Posted: 9/5/2009 8:32 PM ET
Member Since: 12/11/2008
Posts: 1
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This means, "Received but with a problem?"

I had one recently, but I simply told the lady that I had to report it to the mgt. It truly was bad.....not only warped from "old water" damage but also musty (my caveat is against nicotine & mustiness only), as well as blackened from mold all along the entire closed book.Everytime you open the book, it "creaks " from all the many (hundreds) of water damaged pages. It was a hardback too...So beware, people WILL unfortunatly do such a thing. This was really bad.

It was sad, as I really wanted this book. However, there is always a first time I know....  Most of the books come on time, with no problem

This lady did return my credit but with a "huff" saying, she thought I exaggerated. I didn't of course. You don't exaggerate mould.

But IF we could provide a scanned photo, that would easily have solved the debate. Pictures don't lie. Not with water damage that is severe

as to be non-postable, and old damge (not new rain water)

I think this was the only problem, other then a time of a lost book - and the post office said that a heavy book in a cheap manila envelope that moves around, will surely fall out!  That is what happened in this case I'm sure., before it even left the state.

Most of the people seem to be both friendly, honest & realistic here I think.

I wish people would take the time to wrap their books carefully, with lots of tape and even use as my daughter does and told me about,a paper bag like the kind you get at the grocery store.  Cut that to  double & wrap the size of the book,  it makes a strong wrapping and then use the PBS white paper address label  with tape over it. 
I don't think I've ever rec'd a negative remark about my mailing, only compliments.

Works great!

 

 

 

 

 

Date Posted: 9/5/2009 9:22 PM ET
Member Since: 7/19/2008
Posts: 15,476
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There is an option to RWAP by USPS damage.  When I mark a book that way, I'm careful to send a nice email to the sender explaining that I do not think they were responsible for the damage and that I do not expect my credit back.  But I might want to get back in the WL line, if needed.  Face it, with as many media mail books as PBS sends, some are going to get under trucks and into machines.  I've always marked those as resolved right away. 

Date Posted: 9/5/2009 10:42 PM ET
Member Since: 7/7/2007
Posts: 4,815
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<<But IF we could provide a scanned photo, that would easily have solved the debate.>>

Ralph--

You can easily do this if you have a digital camera or web cam.  When I get a damaged book, I take photos of the damage, put them on a free photo sharing site (like Flickr or Photobucket) and include a link to the image(s) in my PM to the sender. 

Cheers,

Catt

Date Posted: 9/6/2009 6:03 AM ET
Member Since: 8/18/2009
Posts: 375
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Well I got my credit back - along with a snippy PM about how the book was readable and I should not expect perfect or new books from a used book website *sigh*.  I PM'd her back thanking her for the credit and the quick response and included the PBS guidelines for postable condition of a book, but I have no confidence that she will hesitate to post a book like that again since she seems to feel readability should be the only criteria.  Oh well, at least it was resolved quickly.  Man, I hate confrontation!  Thanks for all the support everyone!

Date Posted: 9/6/2009 8:16 AM ET
Member Since: 5/14/2009
Posts: 6,852
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LOL - Karen -I trhink we all hate confortation and I think some members count on it!   I am happy to hear that it all ended well.   Now on to your next swap :)