Discussion Forums - Questions about PaperBackSwap Questions about PaperBackSwap

Topic: Underlining in text

Club rule - Please, if you cannot be courteous and respectful, do not post in this forum.
  Unlock Forum posting with Annual Membership.
Subject: Underlining in text
Date Posted: 8/1/2010 9:33 AM ET
Member Since: 6/23/2010
Posts: 148
Back To Top

Friday and yesterday I received a book each day with minor underlining and one book with the first paragraph in the book marked with a huge parenthesis which made me look more carefully at both books.  The book Friday had a paragraph outlined with a thin magic marker and several paragraphs with "stick marks" at the beginning and ending of paragraphs but the other book had pencil underlining and a large ink parenthesis.  I kept both books because I can and will read them but now I can't repost them because of the markings.  I joined PBS to read and recycle books.  I am really not picky but now am thinking about an RC with "no underlining in the text" which shouldn't be necessary because it is one of PBS standards.  I don't want to go through the trouble of sending these books back but I want to prevent this from happening again so that I can recycle the book when I am done reading it.  I am new to PBS.  I have ordered 4 trades/1 PBS mkt new books.  I received one in great shape, 2 with minor underlining, one new from PBS mkt and one one the way.  What do you do about underling in books you receive? Thanks in advance for your thoughts.

Date Posted: 8/1/2010 10:46 AM ET
Member Since: 1/3/2010
Posts: 118
Back To Top

Unless it is a textbook, any writing on the text pages should make a book unpostable.  You could record it as received with a problem when you get the book to earn your credit back. 

Laura M. (LMM) - ,
Date Posted: 8/1/2010 11:16 AM ET
Member Since: 12/12/2005
Posts: 524
Back To Top

Any book can be considered a textbook, but the condition MUST be described to the requestor and agreed to before sending.  Many lit classes, etc use novels as "texts" so they can have underlining/highlighting, but (again) it must be agreed to.

From the Help Documents:

If a member considers her book a textbook she may Post it with underlining/highlighting/writing on text pages, according to the "textbook exception" in the Book Condition Criteria for 'Swappability' at PBS; BUT since the textbook exception in the Book Condition Criteria for 'Swappability' at PBS require her to contact the requestor and obtain PM consent to the book's condition, she won't be in the position of sending a "stealth textbook" to someone who doesn't expect to receive one.

Date Posted: 8/1/2010 11:34 AM ET
Member Since: 8/23/2007
Posts: 26,510
Back To Top

You can still repost these books.  You just need to PM the requestor like it was a text book.  If they're WL, I would offer them in the book bazaar and state about the underlining.  If they weren't WL then I'd probably just donate them somewhere.  Not every book you get from PBS will be repostable after you read the book. Although you are within your rights to complain about books with writing and underlining when you receive them if you weren't asked first.

Date Posted: 8/1/2010 11:53 AM ET
Member Since: 6/4/2010
Posts: 96
Back To Top

I just went through this same problem this week.  I was told to mark it as "received with a problem" and request your credit back on the damaged books.  There are rules that we all have to follow so that everyone is satisfied and keeps coming back to PBS for future books.  

I started an RC yesterday that states:

It is silly that I have to list this as a RC. I am only interested in books that follow the book condition criteria for 'Swappability' at PBS.  :)  No "unpostables", thank you so much.

I would rather have a trader refuse my RC and then get passed onto the next trader in line rather than having to mess with an unpostable book.  I am hoping that the RC will make the trader rethink mailing out a damaged book.  I am not picky and I know that we are trading "used" books.  I am not looking for "new" books...just books that I can later trade and not get in trouble for posting.

If you have already marked your books as "received" and you can not get your credit back...you can post them as "unpostable" over at the Book Bazaar Forum.  Just make sure to list the books as "unpostable".  You can offer a deal of "Free unpostable book with any book ordered from my shelf" or "2 books for 1 credit". Just be sure to list everything that is wrong with the book so that the other person can decide if they want the damaged book or not.  There is a "red" sticky thread at the top of the forum that has the rules to using the Book Bazzar.

I hope that I have helped a little, I am still pretty new so some of the other members may have some tips or advice that are better than what I listed. wink  Sabrina



Last Edited on: 8/1/10 11:54 AM ET - Total times edited: 1
Date Posted: 8/1/2010 11:55 AM ET
Member Since: 2/11/2007
Posts: 808
Back To Top

I've never gotten a book with underlining in it (nor highlighting either). Just for the record, I think the idea that any book could be a textbook is rather rediculously out-of-hand.

Date Posted: 8/1/2010 12:47 PM ET
Member Since: 6/23/2010
Posts: 148
Back To Top

Thanks for the thoughts and suggestions.  Sabrina, you exactly stated my mind/heart on the subject.  I had already marked the first book received but found the markings on the second book before marking it.  I thought about it and marked it received but commented on the condition and wrote the sender about it too.  Both books are reprinted classics (one in 1999 and the other in 2004) so they very well could have been used in a lit class.  However, the books could have also been marked by an zealous bookclub reader.  I like Sabrina's RC and will do one similar.  I also do not want a new book - in fact one of my most favorite books, "Too close to the Falls" , had editorial comments all the way through - some made me laugh out loud.  I also realize that when I finish reading something it may not be postable anymore.  However, if I follow the rules, I am limited with what I can do with a book with underlining in the text.  I will probably take these to work when I am done and leave them in the breakroom for someone else or release them in a public place where they might be picked up.  Again, thanks for the advice as I am definitely better informed on this issue.

Date Posted: 8/1/2010 4:29 PM ET
Member Since: 6/15/2006
Posts: 5,751
Back To Top

There have been a few inaccurate posts here so this is just to clarify the rules: 

You will NOT be able to post these books to your bookshelf. You should mark them received with a problem and request your credits back.

You could offer them in the Book Bazaar stating the underlining but they cannot be added to your bookshelf for regular swapping since they are unpostable.

Every book you get from PBS should meet the PBS Book Condition Guidelines and ,unless you damage them while you read, be repostable when you're done. That's how the system is meant to work.

You should not be contacted about a books condition except for Cookbooks, Textbooks and Travel Guides which you must be PMed about before they can be shipped to both agree on the books condition. Any regular book that does not meet the guidelines should not be posted.

I hope that this clarifies what should be done. Sorry that this happened to you. It's so frustrating to get a book that shouldn't have been posted and have to deal with the situation. I hope it all get's straightened out and you get your credits back.

Date Posted: 8/2/2010 1:23 AM ET
Member Since: 1/17/2009
Posts: 9,664
Back To Top

You will NOT be able to post these books to your bookshelf. You should mark them received with a problem and request your credits back.

But according to the rules you can consider pretty much any book to be a textbook. It doesn't have to be used personally as a textbook by you. They are postable to your shelf as long as you follow the rules about PMing the next requestor and receiving acceptance of the writing condition first.

I took many classes in college where non-traditional materials were used as the textbooks. Including a science fiction class which consisted exclusively of novels.

Here is the PBS explanation of "What is a textbook":

 

Actually, the way the system and rules are designed, it does not matter what the "objective definition" of a textbook is.  The club members decide this - as long as the rules in the Book Condition Criteria for 'Swappability' at PBS are followed.  See the explanation and examples below.

If a member considers her book a textbook she may Post it with underlining/highlighting/writing on text pages, according to the "textbook exception" in the Book Condition Criteria for 'Swappability' at PBS; BUT since the textbook exception in the Book Condition Criteria for 'Swappability' at PBS require her to contact the requestor and obtain PM consent to the book's condition, she won't be in the position of sending a "stealth textbook" to someone who doesn't expect to receive one.

Examples/further explanation:

  • Member A posts an Economics 101 textbook - something that most people would clearly consider a textbook.   
  • Following the Book Condition Criteria for 'Swappability' at PBS textbook exception rules, she sends a Personal Message to the requestor when she gets a request, describing the book's condition.
  • Chances are good that she will get PM consent from the requestor to send the book with highlighting/etc. 
  • Member B posts a novel (fiction) that she used in a class - something that most people would NOT consider a textbook.
    • Following the Book Condition Criteria for 'Swappability' at PBS textbook exception rules, she sends a Personal Message to the requestor when she gets a request, describing the book's condition.
    • Chances are good that she will NOT get PM consent from the requestor to send the book with highlighting/etc.
    • If the requestor declines the book in its condition, Member B will have to cancel the request and repost her book.  It will go to the 'back of the line' for requests.  (If it is a Wish Listed book, it will be offered to the same wisher and the sender will again have to cancel.  She will have to wait for the wishing member to get a copy of this book from someone else before Member B can post her copy again.)

So, the farther the book is from a 'textbook' in common perception, the more likely it will be difficult to get consent to its condition.  Members in Member B's situation may encounter several declines, and will eventually realize that the book is not likely to be acceptable to the club in its condition.  Member B will stop trying to offer it as a "textbook"  and will consider it instead an unpostable/damaged book.

In this way, the club defines "textbook" on a case-by-case basis, and no one who is following the rules will be able to "surprise" another person with a highlighted/written-in/underlined book.



Last Edited on: 8/2/10 1:24 AM ET - Total times edited: 1
Date Posted: 8/2/2010 8:01 AM ET
Member Since: 6/15/2006
Posts: 5,751
Back To Top

I stand corrected that any book technically can be considered a textbook using this idea but here is why I would encourage members to not consider thinking that way. If you have a Wish Listed book you will have a number of people who will decline your offer and you'll have to cancel the transaction and wait to repost  it and you might end up getting a request at some point. I for one would not be very happy to have been waiting for a book and be offered an, what I consider to be, unpostable book, have to wait for it to be cancelled and then be offered it again if it gets posted too quickly. I wouldn't want the hassle as a requester and certainly wouldn't be willing to go through that whole process as a sender. If I wanted an unpostable book, I'd go look for offers in the Book Bazaar.

So, the farther the book is from a 'textbook' in common perception, the more likely it will be difficult to get consent to its condition.  Members in Member B's situation may encounter several declines, and will eventually realize that the book is not likely to be acceptable to the club in its condition.  Member B will stop trying to offer it as a "textbook"  and will consider it instead an unpostable/damaged book.

The danger is if it is NOT a wish listed book. If you have a book with writing or underlining in it that is not a book traditionally thought of as a textbook,  and you post it,  wait a few months for a request and the requester does not want it, you will have cancel the transaction and go back to the bottom of the stack to wait for a few months for another request. I don't think that's worth it at all. Just my opinion.

Date Posted: 8/2/2010 2:50 PM ET
Member Since: 12/28/2006
Posts: 14,167
Back To Top

What Laura said +1

John, I'm going to disagree.  DD just finished college, and we have boxes of texts to prove it!  I've been surprised at the wide variety of books that were required classroom reading (ie texts).  I helped shop for some of them also...the variety and expense is mind boggling.  I also volunteer in our high school library, our school inventories textbooks through their library software.  I've seen some of the teacher lists for classroom reading...they also incorporate a wide variety of required reading material in the curriculum...if it's required for class, it's a textbook.



Last Edited on: 8/2/10 2:51 PM ET - Total times edited: 1
Date Posted: 8/2/2010 4:25 PM ET
Member Since: 2/11/2007
Posts: 808
Back To Top

If that's the case, then why not scrap the "textbook" language altogether is my point.