Discussion Forums - Religion & Spirituality

Topic: What Do You Think About These Rules for Living?

Club rule - Please, if you cannot be courteous and respectful, do not post in this forum.
  Unlock Forum posting with Annual Membership.
T. -
Subject: What Do You Think About These Rules for Living?
Date Posted: 4/26/2008 6:27 PM ET
Member Since: 1/21/2007
Posts: 9,989
Back To Top

1. Do not give opinions or advice unless you are asked.

2. Do not tell your troubles to others unless you are sure they want to hear them.

3. When in another’s home, show him respect or else do not go there.

4. If a guest in your home annoys you, treat him cruelly and without mercy.

5. Do not make sexual advances unless you are given the mating signal.

6. Do not take that which does not belong to you unless it is a burden to the other person and he cries out to be relieved.

7. Acknowledge the power of magic if you have employed it successfully to obtain your desires. If you deny the power of magic after having called upon it with success, you will lose all you have obtained.

8. Do not complain about anything to which you need not subject yourself.

9. Do not harm little children.

10. Do not kill non-human animals unless you are attacked or for your food.

11. When walking in open territory, bother no one. If someone bothers you, ask him to stop. If he does not stop, destroy him.

Date Posted: 4/26/2008 9:32 PM ET
Member Since: 3/31/2006
Posts: 28,486
Back To Top

Though most sound like something to achieve or live by, numbers 4 & 11 kind of threw me.  Are these rules for the animal kingdom?  Just curious.  That's when I thought when I read those two.

T. -
Date Posted: 4/26/2008 10:03 PM ET
Member Since: 1/21/2007
Posts: 9,989
Back To Top

Those 2 are a bit different, aren't they.  They command respect, but are a bit harsh. 

Date Posted: 4/26/2008 10:23 PM ET
Member Since: 6/19/2007
Posts: 5,928
Back To Top

So... whose rules are these?

Date Posted: 4/27/2008 12:21 AM ET
Member Since: 6/8/2007
Posts: 6,358
Back To Top

Gee, I hope you don't follow these, since they are the "11 Satanic Rules of the Earth"...but of course, I'm sure you already know that.

altreligion.about.com/library/faqs/bl_satanism.htm

 



Last Edited on: 4/27/08 12:22 AM ET - Total times edited: 1
T. -
Date Posted: 4/27/2008 12:52 AM ET
Member Since: 1/21/2007
Posts: 9,989
Back To Top

Yes, Patricia, they are Satanic rules  from the Church of Satan.  Altho some of them are strange, what is wrong with following others?   I've studied lots of fringe religions--most of them are pretty benign, including Satanism.  Just a disclaimer--Satanism is NOT the same thing as the devilworshipping that disturbed individuals do when they go on a power trip and kill innocent animals.  See rule number 10.

1. Do not give opinions or advice unless you are asked.  Not a  bad rule to follow.

2. Do not tell your troubles to others unless you are sure they want to hear them.  Again, not bad.

3. When in another’s home, show him respect or else do not go there.  I would hope that anyone who came to my home would be respectful, and I would be respectful as well...so why not follow this one?

4. If a guest in your home annoys you, treat him cruelly and without mercy.   Ok, this one is weird.

5. Do not make sexual advances unless you are given the mating signal.    Pretty good advice, worded awkwardly, but sums up some pretty good advice to me.

6. Do not take that which does not belong to you unless it is a burden to the other person and he cries out to be relieved.   Don't steal...hmmm...sounds good to me.

7. Acknowledge the power of magic if you have employed it successfully to obtain your desires. If you deny the power of magic after having called upon it with success, you will lose all you have obtained.  This one is strange unless you understand what the COS means by magic. 

8. Do not complain about anything to which you need not subject yourself.  Hmm...don't worry about things that don't concern you....

9. Do not harm little children.   And what's wrong with this one?  Extremely good rule.

10. Do not kill non-human animals unless you are attacked or for your food.   Another good one.

11. When walking in open territory, bother no one. If someone bothers you, ask him to stop. If he does not stop, destroy him.     Worded strangely, but basically saying that you have the right to defend yourself.  What's wrong with that?

T. -
Date Posted: 4/27/2008 1:14 AM ET
Member Since: 1/21/2007
Posts: 9,989
Back To Top

Oh, just FYI--I'm not a Satanist or member of any organized religion. 

Date Posted: 4/27/2008 8:27 AM ET
Member Since: 4/20/2006
Posts: 5,647
Back To Top

1. Do not give opinions or advice unless you are asked.

Probably not the worst rule ever, but if you see someone in trouble, it's a good time to break this one!

2. Do not tell your troubles to others unless you are sure they want to hear them.

Good rule!  They might have enough of their own!

3. When in another’s home, show him respect or else do not go there.

Excellent rule!

4. If a guest in your home annoys you, treat him cruelly and without mercy.

No, but you could kick them out, lol!

 

5. Do not make sexual advances unless you are given the mating signal.

Ummmmm........

6. Do not take that which does not belong to you unless it is a burden to the other person and he cries out to be relieved.

I am thinking about the Lord of the Rings here.....or maybe someone carrying a really heavy box.

7. Acknowledge the power of magic if you have employed it successfully to obtain your desires. If you deny the power of magic after having called upon it with success, you will lose all you have obtained.

Power of magic!  Cool!  Can I use it to clean my house and teleport myself?  No more gas money!!

8. Do not complain about anything to which you need not subject yourself.

Well, nothing wrong with being less whiney I suppose.....

9. Do not harm little children.

Duh!

10. Do not kill non-human animals unless you are attacked or for your food.

Another duh!

11. When walking in open territory, bother no one. If someone bothers you, ask him to stop. If he does not stop, destroy him.

Ask no one the time of day.  If they are rude, kill them....with kindness!!

Date Posted: 4/27/2008 2:44 PM ET
Member Since: 10/26/2005
Posts: 438
Back To Top

they are Satanic rules  from the Church of Satan

Since Satan doesn't follow his own rules I don't vote for anyone following them.

Date Posted: 4/27/2008 8:17 PM ET
Member Since: 4/20/2006
Posts: 5,647
Back To Top

If there were a Satan I doubt he would actually bother making rules anyway.  Where would the fun in that be?

So Rebecca, does that mean you think we should harm little children then?  ;)



Last Edited on: 4/27/08 8:18 PM ET - Total times edited: 1
T. -
Date Posted: 4/27/2008 9:03 PM ET
Member Since: 1/21/2007
Posts: 9,989
Back To Top

LOL Amanda--

One of these days maybe people will understand that Satanism or the Church of Satan has NOTHING to do with the person called Satan in the Bible--except maybe in a mocking sense. 

 

Date Posted: 4/27/2008 9:50 PM ET
Member Since: 10/26/2005
Posts: 438
Back To Top

well i'd love to be enlightened :-)

...if satanism has nothing to do with satan why are they so named?

truly, I have no knowledge on this subject...i can't even begin to hazard a guess.

T. -
Date Posted: 4/28/2008 12:54 AM ET
Member Since: 1/21/2007
Posts: 9,989
Back To Top

It was Anton LaVey's little joke to name it Satanism.  Actually, the link Patricia posted has a bit of info, but the COS website has quite a bunch more information.  Here's an excerpt from the official history--

"Anton Szandor LaVey never expected to be the founder of a new religion, but he saw a need for something publicly opposing the stagnation of Christianity, and knew that if he didn’t do it, someone else, probably less qualified, would.

LaVey saw there must be a new representative of justice, someone who understood the torments of being human, who shared our own passions and foibles yet was somehow wiser and stronger. He began to realize that most of our progress in science and philosophy had been achieved by those who rebelled against “God” and the Church, or the dictates of conventional society. We needed a representative for that revolutionary, creative, irrepressible spirit within us. The single figure who fit the bill was clear to LaVey from an early point in his life; a deity whose rebellious, passionate nature had been described, either in awe or fear or both, from the dark beginnings of time.

Satan, by one name or another, haunted mankind, tempting him with sweet delights and enlightening him with blinding secrets intended only for gods. He was one who could be petitioned for powers of retribution and who gave deserved rewards. Instead of creating sins to insure guilty compliance, Satan encouraged indulgence. He was the single deity who could really understand us."

I would recommend reading about the history of Satanism just for the knowledge of knowing about it, just as I would encourage reading about any other religion.  And yes, Satanism *is* a recognized religion in the USA.   

Date Posted: 4/28/2008 1:22 PM ET
Member Since: 10/26/2005
Posts: 438
Back To Top

I *think* I understand.  Your question is similar to one I've been curious to ask.  As our culture (or maybe just the squeaky wheels, I can't tell) cry foul when our country makes laws based on Christian morality what alternative morality would they suggest?  Anton's morality?  interesting....

T. -
Date Posted: 4/28/2008 4:40 PM ET
Member Since: 1/21/2007
Posts: 9,989
Back To Top

Rebecca, I don't know the question nor the answers, but I would think that "morality" is not religion based, but humanely acceptable based.  That sounds awkward, but I'm not particularly eloquent at the moment. 

For example--the rule to not hurt children.  I like that rule.  Many religions incorporate that rule for living into their ideologies.  BUT is the rule in the religions because it is morally wrong or is it morally wrong because it is in the religion?  Chicken or egg?

I'll admit it--LaVey was slightly insane---and he liked freaking out Christians, but he was a psychologic master--he knew the ins and outs of human behaviors and used this knowledge to manipulate.  Not much different than effective leaders of other religions--if you know what makes people tick, what they are drawn to, what they respond to, then you can manipulate them into "performing" the way you'd like them to perform.

One of LaVey's books--the Satanic Witch--is a must read for any single woman looking to snag a man LOL  It has nothing to do with devilworshiping or stuff like that...it is basically a tell all on what men are drawn to--for example--he's talking about 2 women in a bar--one is nude dancing on a table and the other is sitting on a barstool, shy, but unaware that her skirt is hiked up in the back and a hint of her underwear is showing.  He says that men would be more drawn to the hint of underwear showing rather than the bare it all chick.  That it is more seductive, naughty, to look at a woman who doesn't know she's exposing herself.  He gives a lot of little examples of how to seduce a man without seducing a man LOL 

 

L. G. (L)
Date Posted: 4/28/2008 10:35 PM ET
Member Since: 9/5/2005
Posts: 12,412
Back To Top

Not any more or less ludicrous than the other list of 10...

Date Posted: 4/28/2008 10:36 PM ET
Member Since: 12/23/2006
Posts: 4,386
Back To Top

LOL Tammy. I like the not harming little children. That is a darned good one. If only people followed that one a bit more.

Date Posted: 4/28/2008 11:50 PM ET
Member Since: 12/19/2005
Posts: 5,091
Back To Top

the rule to not hurt children.  I like that rule.

One of the things that I like about science fiction is that it looks at all those rules differently, stands them on their head so to speak.  I read a book that featured a race which produced far more young than the society could support, so killing a youngster was not considered immoral.  It was done almost casually.  Killing an adult was a far more serious crime.  Reading about situations like that tends to make one more aware of social conflicts and expectations.

As our culture (or maybe just the squeaky wheels, I can't tell) cry foul when our country makes laws based on Christian morality what alternative morality would they suggest?

The best way to go about it is to make laws based on national consensus and the Constitution.  The problems tend to come about when people try to pass laws that do not have consensus behind them, whether it is banning abortion or legislating equal rights for gays and lesbians.  It doesn't really matter whether these things are *right* in the absolute sense; if society as a whole doesn't support them then the laws won't work.



Last Edited on: 4/29/08 1:48 AM ET - Total times edited: 1
L. G. (L)
Date Posted: 4/29/2008 10:48 PM ET
Member Since: 9/5/2005
Posts: 12,412
Back To Top

I like the no killing at all rule, myself. :)

Date Posted: 4/30/2008 10:28 AM ET
Member Since: 10/26/2005
Posts: 438
Back To Top

For example--the rule to not hurt children.  I like that rule.  Many religions incorporate that rule for living into their ideologies.  BUT is the rule in the religions because it is morally wrong or is it morally wrong because it is in the religion?  Chicken or egg?

This is a Very Interesting Topic and there is much that I would love to ask and respond to but I'm short on time at the moment.  Let me ask Tammy regarding this statement.

What about religions that do not have this rule to not hurt children?  Many ancient religions sacrificed children.  Many modern religions sacrifice their children with suicide bombs or by marrying very young girls off to crusty old men.  Is their religion morally wrong?  Are they going against a universal moral law?  Are they false religions?  Are only religions/cultures  that call for the protection of children true and right and good?  Can we say that cultures who do not have this mandate bad?  It is not pc to label other cultures bad.  How should we get around that?

Was it more reprehensible what the Aztecs were doing to their children or was it more reprehensible what Cortes did to the Aztecs because of what they were doing to their children?  If there is a universal moral law, who gets to decide what it is? And when two worlds collide...Aztec and European...and they do and they will who gets to decide which moral code to go by.  Can 2 opposing moral codes live side by side in peace and harmony?  Could the Europeans have turned a blind eye to the evil (assuming that sacrificing children is evil) among the Aztecs and lived among them peacefully? 

T. -
Date Posted: 5/1/2008 2:27 AM ET
Member Since: 1/21/2007
Posts: 9,989
Back To Top

Those are some great questions, Rebecca.  I wish I had the answers, but I don't.  I do know what you are asking, tho.  Maybe there is no universal morality---morality only exists in this space and time and place and no more.   We can't judge the past or the future based on here and now.  Societies and cultures evolve.  People change.  Maybe there are no absolutes.  We'd like to think that there are absolutes, but realistically?

L. G. (L)
Date Posted: 5/4/2008 6:54 AM ET
Member Since: 9/5/2005
Posts: 12,412
Back To Top

Tammy, I totally think that *everything* is relative.  Everything.  If it weren't everyone's perceptions would be the same.  It's from that difference in perception that learning occurs.