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Topic: why is this an excuse

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Subject: why is this an excuse
Date Posted: 9/4/2010 8:37 PM ET
Member Since: 6/13/2009
Posts: 503
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We wanted to let you know that the book you requested on 9/3/2010 'Baggage
Claim' by Tanya Michna cannot be mailed because of your Requestor Conditions.

The member who this book was ordered from had this to say....

the book has a little bit of writing on the pages, does not meet requestor's
conditions, but this is how I received the book

 

this was the reason I got for a book being denied due to my RC...(no writing please).  Why does this member think it is ok to repost a book "that she recieved with writing in it"....which is considered a non postable book????
 

Date Posted: 9/4/2010 8:48 PM ET
Member Since: 8/20/2008
Posts: 818
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Well...hopefully it is just a new member who (sadly) did not read the rules as well as he or she should have. Other than that...it is not a good excuse. :0(

Date Posted: 9/4/2010 8:49 PM ET
Member Since: 5/14/2009
Posts: 6,852
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It is okay to post a book with writing and highlighting but she has to notify the requestor.  The requestor has to agree to the terms before it is sent. 

ETA to add from the help docs:

What is the definition of a textbook?

Actually, the way the system and rules are designed, it does not matter what the "objective definition" of a textbook is.  The club members decide this - as long as the rules in the Book Condition Criteria for 'Swappability' at PBS are followed.  See the explanation and examples below.

If a member considers her book a textbook she may Post it with underlining/highlighting/writing on text pages, according to the "textbook exception" in the Book Condition Criteria for 'Swappability' at PBS; BUT since the textbook exception in the Book Condition Criteria for 'Swappability' at PBS require her to contact the requestor and obtain PM consent to the book's condition, she won't be in the position of sending a "stealth textbook" to someone who doesn't expect to receive one.

Examples/further explanation:

  • Member A posts an Economics 101 textbook - something that most people would clearly consider a textbook.   
  • Following the Book Condition Criteria for 'Swappability' at PBS textbook exception rules, she sends a Personal Message to the requestor when she gets a request, describing the book's condition.
  • Chances are good that she will get PM consent from the requestor to send the book with highlighting/etc. 
  • Member B posts a novel (fiction) that she used in a class - something that most people would NOT consider a textbook.
    • Following the Book Condition Criteria for 'Swappability' at PBS textbook exception rules, she sends a Personal Message to the requestor when she gets a request, describing the book's condition.
    • Chances are good that she will NOT get PM consent from the requestor to send the book with highlighting/etc.
    • If the requestor declines the book in its condition, Member B will have to cancel the request and repost her book.  It will go to the 'back of the line' for requests.  (If it is a Wish Listed book, it will be offered to the same wisher and the sender will again have to cancel.  She will have to wait for the wishing member to get a copy of this book from someone else before Member B can post her copy again.)

So, the farther the book is from a 'textbook' in common perception, the more likely it will be difficult to get consent to its condition.  Members in Member B's situation may encounter several declines, and will eventually realize that the book is not likely to be acceptable to the club in its condition.  Member B will stop trying to offer it as a "textbook"  and will consider it instead an unpostable/damaged book.

In this way, the club defines "textbook" on a case-by-case basis, and no one who is following the rules will be able to "surprise" another person with a highlighted/written-in/underlined book.



Last Edited on: 9/4/10 8:50 PM ET - Total times edited: 1
Date Posted: 9/4/2010 9:08 PM ET
Member Since: 2/14/2010
Posts: 44
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I thought if book had a person;s name in it, it was still postable

I would consider that writing in the book.

Date Posted: 9/4/2010 9:36 PM ET
Member Since: 6/28/2009
Posts: 5,738
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Last Edited on: 5/27/11 5:57 PM ET - Total times edited: 1
Date Posted: 9/4/2010 11:41 PM ET
Member Since: 5/25/2009
Posts: 599
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Yes, a little writing at the beginning of the book like someone's name or the price of the book is fine. You can't have writing/underlining/highlighting inside the text of the book unless you first notify the recipient and receive permission.

Date Posted: 9/4/2010 11:48 PM ET
Member Since: 1/30/2009
Posts: 5,696
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Yes, but Catherine is correct.  You are permitted to post a book with underlining, etc.  You just aren't permitted to send it without an okay from the requestor.  So there's really no harm, no foul here.  The process was just expedited by the existence of the OP's RC.

Date Posted: 9/5/2010 12:06 AM ET
Member Since: 12/28/2006
Posts: 14,177
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". . . but this is how I recieved the book."  Not an acceptable excuse, unfortunately members keep dredging up this lame comment.  Signed by the president, blessed by the pope, and decorated in gold leaf...unpostable is unpostable. 

Actual postability is already addressed in above comments.



Last Edited on: 9/5/10 12:07 AM ET - Total times edited: 1
Date Posted: 9/5/2010 7:09 AM ET
Member Since: 4/7/2008
Posts: 15,690
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Per the Help Docs:

No writing or highlighting or underlining on  text pages 

  • a signature or note on the flyleaf or inside front or back cover is OKAY
  • an author's signature on the title page is OKAY
  • writing or highlighting or underlining on the text pages is NOT OKAY

So as you can see, a book can be signed and still be perfectly postable and you don't need to PM a person to inform them before hand. The textbook exception only applies to writing on text pages.

Date Posted: 9/5/2010 1:03 PM ET
Member Since: 11/5/2009
Posts: 1,083
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I'm not sure you are allowed to post a book with writing/underlining unless it's a text book.  The book the OP is referring to doesn't sound like it is a text book.

If PBS meant that any book that had writing in it was postable as long as you didn't send it without letting the recipient know about the writing, they would not have referred to the book as a "text book" in that rule.

 

 

Date Posted: 9/5/2010 1:32 PM ET
Member Since: 7/22/2009
Posts: 2,617
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Actually, any book may be considered a textbook under PBS rules -- it's just that the likelihood of a requestor accepting writing or highlighting presumably diminishes with books that are not commonly perceived as textbooks. See the help document that Robin posted above.

Date Posted: 9/5/2010 1:54 PM ET
Member Since: 5/15/2005
Posts: 1,328
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PBS provided an example of a case of listing a novel as a textbook in their newsletter: 

"Dear Librarian- I saw that there is a "textbook exception" that allows textbooks to be posted if they have underlining or highlighting or writing in them.  How do you define a textbook?  What if I have a novel that was used in a class?  - Hesitant in Hattiesburg

Dear Hattie,

The "textbook exception"  has three parts, really.  Each one is very important, and together they help the textbook exception work well in the club.  First, the textbook exception allows textbooks to be posted with writing/highlighting/underlining (no non-textbooks may be posted with such markings). Second, the textbook exception includes the stipulation that the sender write a Personal Message to the requestor describing the book's condition and third (and most important!), the sender must receive a Personal Message in reply from the requestor, agreeing to the described condition, BEFORE sending the book.  If the requestor does not respond, or declines the book in its condition, the sender must NOT send the book - the sender must let the system cancel, or cancel it by clicking "cancel order".

This requirement of a PM exchange with the requestor accepting the book means that it is not possible for a sender who is following the rules to send a "surprise" highlighted/written in book to a requestor.   For that reason, it does not matter what the sender considers a textbook - if it has markings that will allow it to be posted only if it is a textbook, then the sender is bound by the textbook exception rules to describe it in a PM, and must receive a reply PM consenting to its condition, before sending it.  In this way, matters will naturally sort themselves out: the math textbook that a requestor would expect to have writing in it will be accepted when it is described, while the novel that is read for a class will probably NOT be accepted when it is described.  The sender needs to decline if the requestor refuses the book in its condition.  At some point (after enough refusals from requestors), the member who is trying to send a novel as a textbook will realize that since it is not generally perceived as a textbook, it will probably not be possible to send out a marked-up version of that book here. 

Hope that helps clarify this issue! You can read the textbook exception in the Help Center, of course, in the Help doc "Book Condition Criteria". "

Date Posted: 9/5/2010 4:46 PM ET
Member Since: 8/25/2009
Posts: 696
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"this was the reason I got for a book being denied due to my RC...(no writing please).  Why does this member think it is ok to repost a book "that she recieved with writing in it"....which is considered a non postable book????"

So you must have had this problem before, though, to have an RC that is "no writing please"?

Date Posted: 9/5/2010 11:00 PM ET
Member Since: 8/15/2007
Posts: 3,044
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I don't think their saying that means they wouldn't ask someone under the textbook rule first. Sometimes it's hard to convey what you really mean. You write it so you understand it, but then the next person doesn't. So maybe they just meant that they received it that way and would ask someone else and send it on, but they obviously can't since you already say no writing in your RC.