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Topic: Wishlisting Books Without ISBN Numbers

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Subject: Wishlisting Books Without ISBN Numbers
Date Posted: 6/20/2009 3:57 PM ET
Member Since: 4/14/2009
Posts: 13
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I would like to put some A Beka books on my wishlist, but they don't have ISBN numbers.  There have been some books posted previously, so the titles are in the system.  If I wishlist those, would I get notification of when additional books by that title are listed, or would it be pointless for me to hope a connection would be made?  Thank you!

Date Posted: 6/20/2009 5:52 PM ET
Member Since: 2/1/2008
Posts: 3,454
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It looks like all the A Beka books that are or have been posted to the system have been done without the 10 or 13 number ISBN.  They have the PBS issued ISBNs.  Those numbers are only linked to that particular copy of that book.  You would not get notification of additional books by that title if they are listed into the system.  If you did put it on your WL, the only way you would ever get it would be if that particular copy got reposted into the system by the sender posting it from their shelf--in other words, very minute chance. 

I'm not sure if it is possible to put them on you WL without ISBN number, but I can't figure out how it could be done effectively. Sorry :(

Date Posted: 6/20/2009 6:00 PM ET
Member Since: 2/19/2008
Posts: 2,007
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Not quite true Heather.  If there's a listing for the title, even though it may be a PBS number, anyone can post a copy of that title to that same number.  It's not really specific to one copy of the book, though it is created by a member who wants to post their particular copy.  Once it's in the system though, anyone can then click "Post This Book" and post their copy of it.

 ETA: I know this from posting some of my own older books without ISBN's.  Some already had entries into the system, with the correct data, but no copies listed (probably because someone requested the first copy posted).  I was able to simply hit Post This Book to post my copy to the same number, without having to enter all the data.



Last Edited on: 6/20/09 6:03 PM ET - Total times edited: 1
Date Posted: 6/20/2009 6:04 PM ET
Member Since: 2/1/2008
Posts: 3,454
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Wow, didn't know that Bernhard.  Thanks for the correction.  That would sure make posting any of my future books with no ISBNs a lot easier.

Date Posted: 6/20/2009 6:46 PM ET
Member Since: 2/11/2007
Posts: 808
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I may be wrong but ... these A Beka's are under 50 pages and do NOT have a genuine 10/13 digit ISBN. It seem as though they should never have been added in the first place with those system numbers, and are not supposed to be traded here? I could swear that the rules state items under 50 pages with ISBN's (not system numbers!) are permitted if the actual page count is included in the description, and all items under 50 pages without  a "real" ISBN are prohibited?

If so, those system ISBN ones that were entered should be deleted.

 

 

 

Date Posted: 6/20/2009 7:19 PM ET
Member Since: 4/25/2007
Posts: 11,518
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I don't see anything in the Help docs that say non-ISBN items under 50 pages are not allowed.  I did find where it says you shouldn't use an existing short-ISBN record to post your copy of that book:

Because the listing was created manually, the listing represents only one specific copy of the book, and the book is not linked to any other item in the database, even if the titles are the same.  This means that:

  • non-ISBN books on a Wish List
    • will not trigger "Similar-to-wished-for-item" alerts
    • will not trigger a Wish List offer unless that particular copy is reposted into the system by someone who received it through PBS (using the Repost Books area or TBR Pile)
    •  will not be removed automatically when another version of that title is received through the Wish List.
  • "Short ISBNs"
    • cannot be reused to post another copy of that book (the Post Books field will accept only 10 or 13 digit ISBNs)
      • this is because not all the information the first poster provided about the book may match another book of the same title that needs to be posted without an ISBN
    • cannot be added to a Book List (TBR Pile or Books I've Read) manually.
      • If that copy of the book is received through PBS, it can be added to TBR when it is received
      • If that copy of the book is received through PBS, it can be added to BIR when it is reposted from the TBR Pile or Books to Repost area

 

Date Posted: 6/20/2009 8:30 PM ET
Member Since: 7/7/2007
Posts: 4,815
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The info John is thinking of is in the Help Center under "What can be swapped here"

Not allowed:

"leaflets or pamphlets or booklets** without ISBNs (other members complain at spending a credit for these)

**A leaflet/pamphlet is an item with fewer than 20 pages; a booklet is an item with between 20 and 50 pages that is not a children's book. Children's books often have less than 50 pages and are not considered booklets just because of their short pagelength."

So, a non-children's item under 50 pages with no ISBN would not be postable here, so no point in wishing.  Sorry Herman.

Cheers,

Catt

Date Posted: 6/20/2009 10:32 PM ET
Member Since: 2/11/2007
Posts: 808
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Thank you, Catt

I did notice that A Beka seems to have textbooks that are over 50 pages - which should be okay to post without ISBN's. It's the "teacher guides" and other supplemental materials that seem to be under 50 pages. Those, it seems to me, would best be advertised "free with any order" in the Homeschooling Forum perhaps?

 

Date Posted: 6/20/2009 11:34 PM ET
Member Since: 2/19/2008
Posts: 2,007
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Sarah, thanks for bringing that up.  I never saw that in the Help section before, and I know that at least four of my books were added to my bookshelf that way.  I wonder if this is something new that was added after that?  Hmm... I wonder if I should now remove those books from my bookshelf (still have two of them I think) and repost them with new short #'s?

Date Posted: 6/21/2009 12:15 AM ET
Member Since: 12/28/2006
Posts: 14,177
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I've used lots of A Beka books, the large majority of them are well over 50 pages.  I've also traded them here at PBS, they are very postable.

Herman, you may wish to stalk the Homeschool thread, A Beka may show up there.  The publisher tends to update those texts, so you will want to double check to make sure you are getting the issue you need :-)  Great curriculum, good luck!!

ETA - Also, texts and workbooks have their own criteria for postability (ie writing & highlighting).  You will want to be familiar with those portions of the posting guidelines.



Last Edited on: 6/21/09 12:18 AM ET - Total times edited: 2
Date Posted: 6/21/2009 10:35 AM ET
Member Since: 8/23/2007
Posts: 26,510
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I just checked the help docs and those 5 digit ISBNS are only supposed to reused if everything matches exactly-page #, book dimensions and such.

I generally don't WL this as the likelyhood of them being reposted to that PBS ISBN is slim-unless it's the only WL option.  For an out of print book sometimes there just aren't any copies out there with ISBNS.  So WL the PBS ISBN ones at least put them in the system as WL books and inspire someone who has them to post them.

 

Date Posted: 6/21/2009 12:15 PM ET
Member Since: 2/11/2007
Posts: 808
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Denise:   please note that I corrected myself that it's the A-Beka "workbooks" under 50 pages that shouldn't be posted as "books" if they are under 50 pages (as they have no ISBN's of their own it seems).

As for the short ISBN's, I thought I'd read several times in forums we weren't supposed to ever re-use them at all, which seemed kind of silly to me if it's obviously the same book, with details matching exactly.

 

 

 

Date Posted: 6/22/2009 2:02 AM ET
Member Since: 12/28/2006
Posts: 14,177
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I don't understand short ISBN's at all.  Although I do know there are some very popular upcoming releases that seem to have aquired short ISBN numbers prior to the release of their proper ISBN.  Some have lenghty wishlists under the wrong/short ISBN, and unfortunate members are going to be very disappointed to discover they are waiting in the wrong line :-)

Date Posted: 6/22/2009 11:06 AM ET
Member Since: 8/23/2007
Posts: 26,510
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It doesn't say specifically in the help docs that you can't reuse them for books besides that specific copy. But it does say that if you do reuse everything had to match: book dimensions, page number etc...,  It was worded to kind of discourage them being reused for anything but that copy without specifically forbidding it. 

Date Posted: 6/22/2009 11:24 AM ET
Member Since: 2/11/2007
Posts: 808
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I don't understand short ISBN's at all.  Although I do know there are some very popular upcoming releases that seem to have aquired short ISBN numbers prior to the release of their proper ISBN.  Some have lenghty wishlists under the wrong/short ISBN, and unfortunate members are going to be very disappointed to discover they are waiting in the wrong line :-)

To me, this seems a mis-use of the 5-digit option, by folks who just can't (won't) wait for the actual ISBN to become available. It is incredibly stupid, because when the book eventually does get posted, the owner is going to use the actual ISBN!

Date Posted: 6/23/2009 10:33 PM ET
Member Since: 4/14/2009
Posts: 13
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This was very informative! Thank you to all who contributed!