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Topic: Is it even worth marking RWAP anymore??!!!

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Subject: Is it even worth marking RWAP anymore??!!!
Date Posted: 1/27/2009 7:58 AM ET
Member Since: 1/24/2008
Posts: 7,253
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I have been here for just over a year. In all that time I only received one RWAP book and the transaction was nice and smooth with the other PBS member. In the last week I have received two books that are not in postable condition (cleaved spines, warped pages, pages coming away from spine, book covers torn, etc). In one instance, I did get my credit back but still received an unkind reply. In the second instance, the member is already getting argumentative. I just think from now on (unless it is a WL book) I am just not going to bother. The book will just end with me then. I really get that this is a used book site (and I don't think the book should be like-new) but they should at least be readable.

IMHO, if someone complained about one of my books, I would just return the credit if only for the fact that it has never happened to me in my year that I have been here and I would trust that the member was being honest (unless the book was brand spanking new, then I might question it but I would still be respectful with my reply). Stuff happens and I may have missed something.  But I just see no reason to automatically basically call someone a liar right off the bat over one book that may have really had a problem.

Sorry, rant over. Thanks for listening. :-)

Date Posted: 1/27/2009 8:12 AM ET
Member Since: 8/23/2007
Posts: 26,510
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Keep marking them RWP. Report nasty responses.  That's what helps weed these people out of PBS.

Date Posted: 1/27/2009 8:53 AM ET
Member Since: 9/24/2007
Posts: 453
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I second what Mary says.  The only way to get rid of poor swappers is if people mark them RWAP.  If they get argumentative enough they will get weeded out.  If you don't mark it RWAP you let them get away with it.  Asking for the credit or not is totally up to you but please continue to mark RWAP.


Date Posted: 1/27/2009 9:17 AM ET
Member Since: 5/6/2008
Posts: 5,441
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I agree with Sara and Mary.  I go to a lot of trouble to make sure what is going into or back into PBS is a nice book.  Why let the spoilers get away with it.

Date Posted: 1/27/2009 9:25 AM ET
Member Since: 1/24/2008
Posts: 7,253
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Ya'll are right. I think I just got a little annoyed about the inference that I was lying (not to mention I received the book with one piece of scotch tape holding the book in the envelope).  

Date Posted: 1/27/2009 9:30 AM ET
Member Since: 5/22/2007
Posts: 9,682
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Nicole, if the books don't meet PBS guidelines defintely mark them RWAP. Those swappers need to be weeded out and know they can't get away with it. You can point them to the Help Center for PBS guidelines about what is postable here and what is not or copy and paste them to them.  Here's what the Help Center has to say about this (especially read the bottom part):


We cannot mediate individual problem swaps at PBS.  We can't adjudicate from a distance; moreover, the club is large enough that even intervening in the small percentage of disputed transactions would not be possible time-wise.  This is why marking a problem swap received "with a problem" is so important: if a sender's account shows a pattern of problems, we will intervene and the sender may be expelled from the club. 

If a book you requested using credit(s) arrives with an "official" problem, you need to

  • send a Personal Message to the sender either during the process of marking the book received and/or using the PM button on the transaction in your Transaction Archive, as described in How do I contact another member?.

Your PM should be polite but clear.  It should clearly ask for a response, and if you want a credit refund, this information should also be included in the PM.

You should give the sender a week to respond.

We suggest this text: "Thanks for sending the book.  Unfortunately there is a problem [explain the problem here--if this was an unpostable book you can say that the problem "makes this unpostable by site guidelines, and I won't be able to swap the book again"].  I would like a credit refund, which can be accomplished by clicking Give Refund in your transaction archive on the Request Details page for this swap, and I will be happy to mail the book back to you if you will provide postage."

  • If the problem is resolved by the sender, submit that information in follow-up from your transaction archive.
  • If the problem is NOT resolved by the sender (and negotiations are finished), submit that information in follow-up from your transaction archive.


Last Edited on: 1/27/09 9:32 AM ET - Total times edited: 1
Date Posted: 1/27/2009 9:42 AM ET
Member Since: 6/21/2007
Posts: 2,015
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Last Edited on: 2/3/15 5:12 PM ET - Total times edited: 1
Date Posted: 1/27/2009 10:41 AM ET
Member Since: 4/4/2008
Posts: 51
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I sympathise with you. I've received dozens of books through PBS and all but two were acceptable. Pretty good odds for a used book site I think. My gripe is when a book clearly should not have been posted is sent and I have no other option of getting my credit back unless the sender is 'nice enough' to refund.

For example I got a book just last week that didn't meet a requestor condition. (I don't want book club editions. The book actually had the words "book club edition" on the cover.) The sender insisted it wasn't and refused to refund credit. Now in cases like this I'll mark it RWAP and just repost it on my bookshelf except this book did not have a ISBN number so I guess I'm screwed out of my credit with a book I've no use for. I don't even know how they posted the book without an ISBN. I just wish there was a way to get my credit back.

My rant ends here.


Cathy A. (Cathy) - ,
Date Posted: 1/27/2009 11:21 AM ET
Member Since: 12/27/2005
Posts: 4,150
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You can repost this book. Just go to the Post Books page and click on Post a Book Without an ISBN. You might want to double check the copyright page for the ISBN though. I haven't seen a BCE book without an ISBN in ages, though sometimes they are hiding in the small print.

Date Posted: 1/27/2009 11:43 AM ET
Member Since: 8/19/2007
Posts: 4,329
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I got one where the pages were coming out of the book (granted it was an older book), but still PBS rules are PBS rules.  I asked for my credit back.  She argued, but I did get it back.  I've had people ask for credits back and I've given them.  Haven't found anyone lying so far.  I usually ask for the book back also, so I can see what I missed.  I usually fan the pages when I buy a used book, again when I post it, and one last time before I accept it for shipment, and I've still missed on a couple of occasions. 


Date Posted: 1/27/2009 11:53 AM ET
Member Since: 1/21/2007
Posts: 2,024
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I've had that a few times. Mostly books arrived heavily stained and everytime I ask for my credit back they tell me that they received the book in the same condition. I always reply that just because they received the book in this particular condition doesn't make it ok to post against the rules.

Some want to discuss some tell me the book was fine.

I don't argue too much. I just tell them that I will mark the problem as unsolved in their swapping history and that this is going to leave a mark in their history.

I always send a picture of the book with my message and some still deny anything is wrong with the book. *rolling eyes*

Date Posted: 1/27/2009 12:13 PM ET
Member Since: 8/9/2007
Posts: 4,058
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It really doesn't take that many RWAP transactions - marked unresolved, with nasty responses recorded in the transaction dialogue - to indicate a "pattern" in someone's transaction record.  Think about it this way - if you mark all unresolved RWAPs as such, and there's a nasty response in the transaction dialogue, it's permanently recorded in this person's transaction archive, so if PBS looks at their archive for any reason, they'll see it and any other problem transactions that might be there.  Chances are, that if a member is brazen enough to send you an unpostable book, refuses to resolve the problem, and then gets nasty about it, your case is not an isolated incident.  It has either happened before, or it will happen again, and all unresolved RWAPs get that "behind the scenes" double mark that is a red flag to the PBS team, and brings some closer scrutiny to a member's transaction record.  Here's something from the help docs on unresolved RWAP transactions:

What happens when you submit follow-up

  • Sender resolved the problem
    • this removes the "Was Problem Resolved?" button from the transaction
    • this does NOT change the problem icon in the Transaction Archive
    • Adds the notation that the problem was resolved to the Transaction Archive
      • this text appears on both sender 's and requestor's transaction archives
    • Changes the swap status "behind-the-scenes" so that this problem swap does not count as heavily against the sender as an unresolved problem
  • Sender did NOT resolve the problem
    • this removes the "Was Problem Resolved?" button from the transaction
    • does NOT change the problem icon in the Transaction Archive
    • Adds the notation that the problem was NOT resolved to the Transaction Archive
      • this text appears on both sender 's and requestor's transaction archives
    • Adds a "double mark" against the sender in his or her account record "behind the scenes"
So the best thing you or anyone else can do in these cases - for PBS and all of the members - is to mark every RWAP you receive, and then update the transaction record as to whether it was resolved or not.  People who always resolve their problem transactions will have a lot less to worry about than those who don't.  And always, ALWAYS communicate with your senders through the book transaction dialogue, and not just separate PMs.  If you're always marking your problem transactions RWAP, this won't be a problem, as the dialogue box will automatically pop up when you mark it; it's the "A personal message for a book you have sent" inbox that is attatched to every transaction in your archive.

Date Posted: 1/27/2009 12:27 PM ET
Member Since: 6/21/2007
Posts: 2,015
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Last Edited on: 2/3/15 5:12 PM ET - Total times edited: 1
Date Posted: 1/27/2009 1:23 PM ET
Member Since: 1/9/2009
Posts: 12
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I am glad to see this thread, I received a book yesterday that I wonder if I should have marked it RWAP. It was a hardcover, no dust jacket ( I know that is allowed) but it was all stained from food or something. It wasn't water damaged, but I was so grossed out over the condition of this book that I don't want to touch it let alone read it. I did pm the sender but did not ask for my credit back because I thought officially it was nor RWAP. But I can tell you that this book is going straight in the trash and not through the system again.  I know they won't all be pristine or anything. I have received a few books that were well worn, but they certainly were not gross like this one. .. So opinions please.. Should I have marked this RWAP? Or am I just too fussy? I am still pretty new here.

Date Posted: 1/27/2009 1:29 PM ET
Member Since: 8/9/2007
Posts: 4,058
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Food stains - any stains - are not allowed, so yeah, it was an RWAP. 

Date Posted: 1/27/2009 1:31 PM ET
Member Since: 1/24/2008
Posts: 7,253
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Denise, I would say it was an RWAP. Stains are against PBS rules. If it is a small one, I usually don't complain. However, if it is so bad that it is going in the trash, I would have marked RWAP and requested the credit back.

Date Posted: 1/27/2009 1:41 PM ET
Member Since: 9/13/2007
Posts: 2,520
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If you aren't sure if a book is RWAP the first thing you should do is to review the posting guidelines in the help documents. They are pretty straight forward.
Date Posted: 1/27/2009 7:19 PM ET
Member Since: 4/25/2007
Posts: 11,631
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Please keep marking the RWAP swaps as such!  If they're sending you an unpostable book, they're doing it to other people too.  If everyone they send an unpostable to marks it as such, PBS will have a nice record of their problems.

If you get nasty PMs in response to asking for your credit back, report them to PBS.  There is no need for other members to be nasty to you about a problem transaction.  Even if they think you're lying, they can not be nasty about it.  PBS can look at all PMs so send in a report and let them sit in your inbox.

Enough of a record of problems, people will lose their account.  Besides, you've spent a credit on these books.  You should be able to repost them and recoup that credit if you want to.  If you get an unpostable, it's like the sender's stolen a credit from you because you can't repost the book to get your credit back.

Subject: RWAP
Date Posted: 1/29/2009 12:05 AM ET
Member Since: 12/7/2008
Posts: 12
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I recently received a book that was missing the complete first chapter of the book.  When I contacted the sender he said it was a mistake and he was supposed to send the book to another member.  All I could think was what a "flake!"  He didn't even feel bad about the missing chapter.  I don't understand that complete disregard for the rules and protocal.  I'm sure his RWAP will catch up to him.

Kimberly S.

Last Edited on: 1/29/09 12:06 AM ET - Total times edited: 2
Date Posted: 1/29/2009 12:13 AM ET
Member Since: 1/19/2006
Posts: 472
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I mostly agree with Sarah, however, books do eventually wear out, so you should be able to post it when you open the envelope, but every book does have it's read in it some where.  Some day that might be you.

I'm not encouraging the posting of bad books or not marking RWAPs, just saying that books do eventually wear out.

Date Posted: 1/29/2009 8:00 AM ET
Member Since: 1/24/2008
Posts: 7,253
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I'm not encouraging the posting of bad books or not marking RWAPs, just saying that books do eventually wear out

I totally agree. I probably receive one book a month where I know I will be its last swap and I really don't mind that at all. I just give those ones away when I can.