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Topic: It Makes Me Wonder...

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Subject: It Makes Me Wonder...
Date Posted: 3/14/2016 12:39 PM ET
Member Since: 2/26/2013
Posts: 741
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I posted a wish list book sometime last week.  31 people had it listed.  As yet it's still not requested, and I just checked and there are 25 people showing as having it wish listed.  So it's rolled through 6 people already and I wonder how many more before someone actually accepts.  If it weren't for the fact that someone out there actually wants the book, I'd pull it and donate it. One thing is at least it's moving people up faster who are waiting for it, but on the other hand, why are people keeping books on their WL if they're not interested?  One or two, maybe, but six so far?  It doesn't seem fair to people who actually want a book, and it makes me wonder how many lists I'm on where people are doing this.

Date Posted: 3/14/2016 1:44 PM ET
Member Since: 6/30/2008
Posts: 2,921
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There is great variablility in other people's behavior. hard to predict. I have had books that went though several people before a request materialized. I have also had a wished book that was accepted by the first person on the list. I think maybe a general rule might be that nonfiction gets requested quicker than fiction. just a guess though. When I request a book I have begun to expect that the request will pass from one or two members before it is sent. I have noticed lately that most of the requests I have made have been to a la carte members. I would say more than half. I just today received a book from an alc  member and it was a very nice book well packaged.

Date Posted: 3/14/2016 2:04 PM ET
Member Since: 8/19/2007
Posts: 4,286
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I had one last week that went through 3 people before finally being requested. At least two of them were ala carte members, so I'm presuming they just abandoned their accounts as the book went the whole two days before rolling over to the next member. Pat

Date Posted: 3/14/2016 2:49 PM ET
Member Since: 2/13/2007
Posts: 2,272
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I believe there is a massive number of abandoned accounts causing this to happen. I avoid posting FIFO whenever possible because I've experienced the same thing...rolling thru countless members who never respond. Its very frustrating! I know that PBS uses these non-response times to determine if a member is active or not but IMO there are more effective ways to do it, such as if you don't sign into your account every 90 days it goes on hold until you do sign in. My fear is that many people do what you are tempted to do...just donate the book rather than post it. I appreciate every member who does go thru the (what can be) extended wait period for your book to be accepted because there are still so many active members who are eager to receive books.

Date Posted: 3/14/2016 2:59 PM ET
Member Since: 2/26/2013
Posts: 741
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This is a cookbook I aquired at a conference and has never been used, so it's not a novel.  But yeah, this has happened more than once and of course, it does make me want to donate it.  The only reason I never do is because I realize that at least one person will be grateful to have it.  Believe me, if I get offered a wish list book, I accept the minute I see the email.  I don't make anyone wait.

Date Posted: 3/14/2016 4:27 PM ET
Member Since: 6/30/2008
Posts: 2,921
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The most common hickey I have when I have a wish listed book available is the rc on the book about smoke. I cancel all of those. sometimes a wished book may go through  a few wishers before I can send it.

Date Posted: 3/14/2016 6:23 PM ET
Member Since: 2/5/2007
Posts: 30,800
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I joined in 2007 and the first wish list book I posted went through 12 people.  So it is nothing new!

Date Posted: 3/14/2016 7:35 PM ET
Member Since: 3/11/2008
Posts: 924
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I avoid posting FIFO whenever possible because I've experienced the same thing...rolling thru countless members who never respond.

I totally understand where you're coming from (and it would be frustrating to have a wishlist book take so long to be accepted), but I can't help but think that avoiding posting FIFO and only posting to friends helps drive people away as well. Those of us who haven't abandoned our accounts but also don't really participate in the community of friends that the new membership thing has created won't have any reason to stay because no one ever posts books on their wishlist anymore. frown 

 



Last Edited on: 3/14/16 7:35 PM ET - Total times edited: 1
Date Posted: 3/15/2016 7:22 AM ET
Member Since: 6/26/2006
Posts: 599
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Also have you checked the isbn?  The title may be wishlisted, but maybe as a different isbn than your version.  I have an audiobook that is sitting on my bookshelf for that very reason. 

Date Posted: 3/15/2016 8:59 AM ET
Member Since: 6/20/2007
Posts: 4,979
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I recently posted well over 50 childrens books, many of which were WL. None were on my friends' WL, so they all went to FIFO. Most were accepted by the first wisher, one went through 3 wishers, and one I declined the first 3 wishers due to crazy RCs! I don't often reject RCs, but these were all nuts IMHO--one was 7 lines of "I will accept...I won't accept." All I wanted to do was send the book!!

Date Posted: 3/15/2016 9:18 AM ET
Member Since: 6/2/2014
Posts: 9,684
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I don't mind RC's but those crazy ones? I'm with you, just offer to the next in line. I had one about that said, and I'm paraphrasing, ..I collect books so the books I request must be in vollectible condition. There can be no marks, sticker prices, wrinkled pages, slanted print or any print errors. New condition with no look of being read.

 

Umm ..no. That's where you go and buy a first editon somewhere brand new where you can see all print, pages etc. Plus collectible? Are you looking for a new rare book worth hundreds or thousands on a used book site??

Date Posted: 3/15/2016 11:08 AM ET
Member Since: 2/13/2007
Posts: 2,272
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Katy, I totally understand your point of view...for the longest time I would ONLY post via FIFO because I felt it was the fair way to do it. But I repeatedly got into situations where a book would actually take weeks to be accepted because it was rolling thru inactive members or hitting a string of RCs that I wouldn't touch with a barge pole. I was getting to the point where I didn't even want to post books because it was so often a frustrating experience. So I begin posting to Friends when I could, which also meant I started getting more books in return because those same Friends were posting books directly to me too. Some books do go FIFO, but 9 times out of 10, the books that go FIFO go thru multiple wishes either due to no response or RCs that I could not send to. Just to be clear, I DO send to RCs when they are clearly written, with no room for interpretation and my book complies.

i think if PBS were more proactive about the abandoned accounts the situation would be remedied and I would happily go back to posting FIFO. Trust me, I am just as annoyed when I see a book on my WL has been posted and it didn't go to me despite being #1 for it, but I also understand why the posting member made the choice they did...they have no way of knowing that all my WL books are on automatic request and they are eager to send the book out and receive a credit in a timely manner.



Last Edited on: 3/15/16 11:10 AM ET - Total times edited: 1
Date Posted: 3/15/2016 12:40 PM ET
Member Since: 8/26/2008
Posts: 791
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If it was a book received from a PBS member, it is on my bookshelf on hold and I can absolutely see if it is on autorequest. If so, I post it FIFO.

I am not involved in the social aspects and as a limited member can not automatically see if the few friends may have it ontheir wish list. I do sometimes check manually. Also, if it is a later book from an author someone at PBS sent me, I will often manually check their wiah list.

Outside of these options, if I have a wish list book to post and the wish is not on auto, I do not bother posting. You can see if the next request is auto or not and act accordingly.

Date Posted: 3/15/2016 1:30 PM ET
Member Since: 6/2/2014
Posts: 9,684
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I know how you feel Mary but AR isn't foolproof.  I've sent to AR, and never hear a word..after the book goes lost, I contacted pbs and they sent thd member an email. Each time, I did get my credit but it was over 30 days. People can abandon their accounts even if their WL is AR. Standard and limited members let stuff roll through..there is no foolproof way.

Date Posted: 3/15/2016 2:22 PM ET
Member Since: 3/11/2008
Posts: 924
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I don't have any of my wishlist on autorequest, especially since I have a limited number of free swaps as a limited member. I always respond within a day or so of the offer. And sometimes I'm not 100% on top of removing the books from my wishlist that I've acquired in other ways, and just in case I forgot to take it off my wishlist I don't want to have it sent to me anyway and waste one of my free swaps.

I think it's important to remember that there are portions of the membership that don't get unlimited swaps. The fewer books that limited and ala carte members get in FIFO because people refuse to post to wishlists where the person at the top isn't on auto-request, or because it might cycle through several people before it's accepted, the less likely they're going to stick around, and all you'll have left is the portion of people willing to spend $20 for a service that ultimately has fewer books available because the others have left.

Date Posted: 3/15/2016 2:47 PM ET
Member Since: 6/2/2014
Posts: 9,684
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I post fifo and sometimes to friends. I've had books roll over in all situations..not an issue imo. None of my books are on AR, there's no point, I still get 48 hours to see if I have the credits. 

Date Posted: 3/15/2016 3:15 PM ET
Member Since: 8/26/2008
Posts: 791
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Pretty much I think if you don't have the credits, then don't waste my time! Put your account on hold until you get a credit and have a swap or cash in account to cover it!



Last Edited on: 3/15/16 3:57 PM ET - Total times edited: 2
Date Posted: 3/15/2016 3:24 PM ET
Member Since: 8/26/2008
Posts: 791
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, especially since I have a limited number of free swaps as a limited member

 This is a fiction. There is no limited free swaps. Swaps can be purchased in quantities of 30  for $12 at any time and do not expire. If you use more than 50 swaps per year, it is more econmical to be standard. If you use less than 50 , just buy the 30 for $12 whenever you need them. You do that by renewing your limited membership which gives you an additional year. I used more than 30 but less than 50, so buying 30 as needed woks for me.



Last Edited on: 3/15/16 4:09 PM ET - Total times edited: 5
Date Posted: 3/15/2016 5:31 PM ET
Member Since: 6/2/2014
Posts: 9,684
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"Pretty much I think if you don't have the credits, then don't waste my time! Put your account on hold until you get a credit and have a swap or cash in account to cover it!"

 

Why should people keep hundreds of credits on hand just in case?

The site allows it so why not take advantage of it?

Your time isn't wasted by posting a WL book, you'll get an email when it's accepted.

While something may be on AR, if I think someone will cause me a problem, I'll cancel, AR isn't a guarantee. Only once did I send to a member that I thought might be a problem and it wasn't, all went well but I wouldn't risk it a second time.

 

You just can't control everything, it is what it is and there is no wrong way to use the site. ...people use it differently as is allowed by PBS but it isn't a time waster to post a book if it isn't accepted in 30 seconds.! lol 



Last Edited on: 3/16/16 11:07 AM ET - Total times edited: 1
Date Posted: 3/16/2016 9:16 AM ET
Member Since: 6/20/2007
Posts: 4,979
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I've sent to AR, and never hear a word..after the book goes lost, I contacted pbs and they sent thd member an email. Each time, I did get my credit but it was over 30 days. People can abandon their accounts even if their WL is AR.

Yup, had this happen at SADVD. Disc was WL on AR. I sent it, and the account was inactive. Even though USPS tracking showed it was delivered 3 days after I sent it, I had to wait until it was declared lost and SADVD determined that the member was inactive to get my credit. I was actually thankful that none of the books I recently posted was on AR; I much prefer that people actively have to log in to accept the book--at least that way I know they're still active. (Which, in some ways is ironic, since all of my books are on AR).

 

Pretty much I think if you don't have the credits, then don't waste my time! Put your account on hold until you get a credit and have a swap or cash in account to cover it!

Nope. Keeping my account active, and if I don't have a credit I will buy one if/when an offer comes in. Not wasting anyone's time, and not buying random credits just in case. I'm on here multiple times a day, plus PBS emails are sent to my phone, so I'm going to know and respond pretty quickly to any offers.

I never have a large credit balance. I have been in a situation where I had 2 credits, and got 3 WL offers within 24 hours. So that 3rd offer by default went to a 48 hour hold. I bought a credit within hours and responded--quicker than I would've normally logged on anyway.

 

especially since I have a limited number of free swaps as a limited member

 This is a fiction. There is no limited free swaps. Swaps can be purchased in quantities of 30  for $12 at any time and do not expire.

As a limited member, every time I request a book, one of my swaps is used up. While you, Mary, may be fine spending $12 every time your 30 swaps run out, others may not use the Site or budget their money or swaps the same way. So when Katy purchased her Limited membership and received her 30 free swaps, that may be her swap budget for the year, and she has every right to choose how to budget her 30 swaps. Everyone here budgets their money--whether it be for swap fees, membership fees, etc.--differently, and as long as everyone is within the Site rules they are all OK. AR is an OPTION, and may not be the right option for everyone. And that is perfectly OK, because one size does not ever fit all.

Date Posted: 3/17/2016 9:35 PM ET
Member Since: 9/18/2008
Posts: 388
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I have my entire WL on AR and try to keep at least a few credits handy.  That said, I've also had WL books I've posted rollover several people before actually getting requested.  I think sometimes people have multiple copies of a book on their WL (different ISBNs or HB vs PB) and then get a copy and forget to remove the other versians.  I know if can be frustrating!  I usually wait until I have several WL books available, then post them to the multiple WL thread.  If no body requests after a week or so, then I post to the system so it goes through the FIFO system. I think that is the fairest way to do it.  Just my opinion of course!  

Date Posted: 3/17/2016 11:48 PM ET
Member Since: 7/23/2005
Posts: 7,404
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All of my WL books are on AR and I don't have hundreds of credits banked. I currently have 25 credits with 6 more due once the books I mailed in the  last two weeks are marked as received.

I don't think you need to have credits banked to cover every book on your WL. (My WL is kind of weird, so I might be talking out of my butt). I've never had 25 WL books come up in a short space of time.



Last Edited on: 3/17/16 11:50 PM ET - Total times edited: 1
Date Posted: 3/18/2016 11:39 AM ET
Member Since: 3/11/2008
Posts: 924
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This is a fiction. There is no limited free swaps.

Ah, thank you for this kind response. Autorequest isn't a requirement here, so stop acting like we're doing it wrong. We all have choices.

As a limited member, I get 30 swaps per year before I have to purchase more. Perhaps I would like to have a little control over what gets sent to me and when. Perhaps I'd like to budget my 30 swaps. There are plenty of books I'd like to have, but if I don't particularly want to buy more credits for them, I'm going to be a little more choosy about them.

Not that it's been a huge issue in the past--wishlist books seem to be much less frequent in recent months, and I've been working on paring down my wishlist to things I really want. But I like to be able to click the button that says yes send it to me, rather than have books automatically showing up at my house that I might have wishlisted three or four years ago and have lost interest in. I also have to account for space, and make sure books are leaving my house at the roughly same rate that they're arriving.

It's fine for you to not want to send books to people who don't give you instant gratification with wishlist autorequest. That's your (shortsighted, IMO) choice. I am just trying to point out that if everyone approaches this place with that attitude, PBS will die because there isn't any reason to pony up money on a service that doesn't actually result in the receipt of books. I managed to receive 30 books within my 12 months last year, but a lot of them were for my kids. We'll see if it works out that way again this year.

Pretty much I think if you don't have the credits, then don't waste my time! Put your account on hold until you get a credit and have a swap or cash in account to cover it!

Unless you are going to the used bookstore or thrift store immediately after seeing the person at the top of the wishlist isn't on autorequest, this is kind of a petty attitude.

On a related note, I've also seen a few people mention how frustrating it is that there are so many inactive accounts and that PBS needs to do better at closing them down. One of the ways to help that along is by allowing your book offers to time out. *shrug* It's a frustrating process, but I'm not sure the PBS staff can handle it all on their own. I have a feeling it's a lot of accounts, but because of the ala carte option, they can't just assume that people who don't have a paid membership are inactive.



Last Edited on: 3/18/16 12:13 PM ET - Total times edited: 1
Date Posted: 3/18/2016 12:37 PM ET
Member Since: 2/28/2009
Posts: 854
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Katy,

Even though my whole wishlist is on autorequest I don't mind sending books to members who do not auto-accept.

When a book is not automatically wishlisted but needs the approval of the requestor it means 1.  the account is actually active or 2. if the account is not active it will trigger an alert that the account may be inactive and it will be eventually closed.

I think it is a win-win, because I am not sending books to people who long ago left the club and will not mark the book received and I am helping to weed out the inactive accounts.

 I am just slightly peeved at the people who left the club, still have books on WL, did not inactivate their account and now don't mark the books received. That is inconsiderate in my opinion.

 

Date Posted: 3/18/2016 3:01 PM ET
Member Since: 2/13/2007
Posts: 2,272
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Because of comments on this thread I decided to post a WL book, with a long list -- 187, FIFO. The first member it went to timed out. That member had 4 books posted and a WL of 49...looking at his account I could see that no books had been added to his bookshelf or WL in 4 years. With a bookshelf and WL that small, it is possible in the intervening 4 years that he only received a few requests or offers...now, no one knows the "magic number" of missed requests before an account is closed but it's higher than 2 or 3, or even 4 or 5. This account could continue to clog up the system for another 4 years before becoming inactive. I'm on to the 2nd person who WLed my book. Their account appears similar to the 1st member. It will probably time out too...

Why am I so frustrated with abandoned accounts? It's not so much that I can't wait to mail the book, it's more that on several ocassions I've requested a book that has multiple copies in the system, but by the time my request has rolled thru several inactive members, the other available copies have been requested and now I've got the book on my WL instead of having the book in my hand, the book that had 10 copies available when I requested it but none when I have spent over two weeks rolling thru non-responsive members.

i want to swap books with active members but there are so many abandoned accounts that really slow that process down. People want to get books here, and I'm sure members walk away from PBS, frustrated with the wait times. The system PBS has in place is no longer adequate to clean out abandoned accounts...all they would need to do is to require a member to sign into their account every three months or their account would be put on hold until they do sign in. That's not onerous and it would sweep a lot of dead wood out of the way. And I would be glad to post books FIFO because it is the fairest way.

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