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Topic: Member has not mailed a delivery confirmation book

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Subject: Member has not mailed a delivery confirmation book
Date Posted: 1/4/2011 5:32 PM ET
Member Since: 9/19/2007
Posts: 114
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I had a book on my wishlist for a long time, and it finally was granted.  However, the person to be mailing this book used the PBS postage and delivery confirmation and then never mailed the book!  I have sent her messages twice, thinking it might be an oversight due to the holidays, but she will not respond.  At first I was concerned that something terrible might have happened to prevent her from mailing, but she has a blog listed on her profile page and she HAS been blogging, so that is not the case.  Had she responded I would have just thought it was a PO problem,  but she hasn't.    Now I'm just irritated.  So while this whole month long waiting has been happening, I have lost out on possible books that might have been mailed.  What do I do to get back on the list, and report this violation?

Date Posted: 1/4/2011 5:39 PM ET
Member Since: 8/18/2005
Posts: 7,977
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  What do I do to get back on the list, and report this violation?

First, how can you be sure the person hasn't mailed the book? Delivery Confirmation is really only supposed to be scanned at Delivery, and may or may not ever be scanned along the way. They've got no advantage to pay for postage and then not mail it.

Second, the site will keep track of the book's mailed-by date, and after 26 days if the sender doesn't mark the book mailed then the site will make it as 'lost' and you'll get your credit back. If you were on a WL for the book, you'll go back to the front.

If the book isn't close to going lost, they may not be wanting to respond. The receiver isn't supposed to PM about a book until close to the 'lost' date, or after. The date is on your membership screen, and they tell you not to contact the site about a book until after a certain date, to give the book time to arrive.

With the crush of the holiday, media mail may move slow in your area. Media mail always goes last, when there's room on the transport, so the P.O. has other mail they have to move first. That's why media mail is cheaper.

Has your book officially gone lost? Are you really sure it wasn't mailed, and how do you know?

Date Posted: 1/4/2011 5:54 PM ET
Member Since: 9/19/2007
Posts: 114
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I completely agree, and I took all that into consideration.  The book will be officially "lost" on the 6th.  Had the sender just replied that the book had been mailed, I certainly agree that the PO can be less than reliable about registering them ( I once had a package returned to me at the same time it was "confirmed" to be delivered elsewhere).
The advantage to her, is that she gets to keep the book she has that she don't want to get rid of, and then she gets a credit for a wishlist item of her own, then she gets it.  I, on the other hand, have possibly lost a book that may be delivered while I'm in limbo. 

So the PO delivery confirmation says they have registered the number, but it has not been scanned into the system.  Again, something I would not be concerned about had the member just told me she sent it.  But since she will not reply to me, I am suspicious.

Date Posted: 1/4/2011 6:02 PM ET
Member Since: 8/23/2007
Posts: 26,510
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Well she paid postage for that credit so it's not like she's getting one for free. And if there's a pattern of lost books, PBS will notice and do something about it. 

And you haven't lost anything.  You'll go back at the top of the list (or close if someone else had issues) and get another copy. 

When did you first PM?  And how long are you giving her to respond?  I know I would get really annoyed if someone PM'd me more than a week before a book was scheduled to go lost to see if I mailed it out.  But I would at least respond. 

 

Date Posted: 1/4/2011 6:09 PM ET
Member Since: 9/19/2007
Posts: 114
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Yes, exactly.  I didn't PM her until two weeks after the "mailed" date, when nothing turned up in the delivery confirmation.  And I just asked her to check because it was the holidays and I knew that things can get hectic.  I would never have PMed her again had she responded that she mailed, because I know things happen.  But since she won't respond, I am getting a bit ticked.  I waited another week to let her get to my message then PMed again, but still nothing.  Like I said, I originally was afraid of something bad, but since she is blogging, she is just ignoring me.  I've had so many great experiences (hundreds) on PBS, that this is a completely different experience for me.

Date Posted: 1/4/2011 6:22 PM ET
Member Since: 8/18/2005
Posts: 7,977
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Like I said, I originally was afraid of something bad, but since she is blogging, she is just ignoring me.

I don't remember how you can tell if you're message has been read or not. But she could have her email settings set so that she doesn't get email notification of new PM's. Maybe she's just not checking in?

I know people are supposed to respond to other members on problem issues, and after a week of no response you can contact TPTB about it and they'll send them a reminder email that they have to respond. But I'm not sure that just ignoring you would be considered a problem transaction.

At least you won't have much longer to wait. I hope you get your WL book quickly from someone else if it doesn't come from this person soon.

Date Posted: 1/4/2011 6:40 PM ET
Member Since: 8/23/2007
Posts: 26,510
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I think PMing 2 wks after the mail by date during the busiest mailing season of the year with more than 1 postal holiday in there was a little premature. Not responding to PMs is a no-no with problem transactions, but this isn't a problem transaction.  Most likely they mailed the book and were annoyed about your PM.  Any scans before delivery are bonus scans and should not be expected.  Books also typically take longer this time of year. 

I deal with a lot of shipping at work (not media mail but still) and everything we sent took at least an extra day to arrive.  Even stuff just going 1 or 2 states away via UPS took longer due to the increase in packages/holiday closues and winter weather.   

Date Posted: 1/4/2011 6:41 PM ET
Member Since: 10/28/2008
Posts: 3,529
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Cindy

 

If you want to see if a pm has been read, click on from me and then click on unread. A check mark will show in the little box next to the pm if the message has not been read

Date Posted: 1/4/2011 6:44 PM ET
Member Since: 12/28/2006
Posts: 14,177
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Gina, nothing on the DC record indicates the sender has done anything wrong.  If she blue boxed the book it may not have been scanned.  In addition, USPS is cutting back on enroute scans.  So it's entirely possible the book could still be in the mail system without benefit of tracking scans.  Recently I've had several travel coast to coast and only acquire a 'delivery' entry, even my local sorting center doesn't scan everything these days. 

Media Mail is iffy in December.  Go ahead and let the book go lost, this will return your credit and return you to your former postion on the wishlist.  Hopefully the next transaction will travel more quickly.

IF you do receive the book, check the postage & postmark carefully.  If there are mailing date issues, the time to notify TPTB is when you log the book in as received...make sure to note in the 'comment' section exactly what type of postage used and any identifying dates.  If the book can be proved to be mailed late, there are conditions under which you do not have to log the book in as received...check help documents for specifics.



Last Edited on: 1/4/11 6:45 PM ET - Total times edited: 1
Date Posted: 1/4/2011 7:33 PM ET
Member Since: 8/19/2007
Posts: 4,300
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I don't know if this will work or not, but if she used PBS DC, you can go to the little truck and possibly see if it's traveling anywhere.

I had someone send a book to my DGD, it was traveling across the country - East Coast to Colorado.  It got within 60 miles of her house, turned around, went back East and started over again.  It was really funny and frustrating to watch, but it did eventually get to her. 

Good luck.  Pat

Date Posted: 1/4/2011 7:36 PM ET
Member Since: 9/19/2007
Posts: 114
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Thank you all.  I am more than understanding for anything that may delay delivery, so I am not trying to persecute this person at all.  I only PMed her to give her a heads up in case the holidays caused her to misplace and not get it actually out in the mail.  And thank you for the info about unread messages....she has not read the messages I sent, so I don't feel so, how should I say...ignored!  But I don't then know how to contact her to see if she has this book in her trunk (not un-understandable with the holidays) or somewhere that she just hasn't gotten around to mailing it.  I just want this book so badly!  But thanks for all your input, it has been very helpful, and I will just wait it out and hope for the best!

Date Posted: 1/4/2011 7:41 PM ET
Member Since: 9/19/2007
Posts: 114
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And Pat O., the truck has been sitting on my city for a long time! 

Thank you, Denise, if I get this book, I am not going to care about issues with it.  I know things happen, which is why I didn't check about it while she wasn't blogging...I was afraid it was something bad.  But since she is alive and well, and just hasn't even checked my PM, then I will assume she will find this book, mortified, and mail it.  We are all a happy reading family and I will be glad to get  it no matter what. 

Date Posted: 1/4/2011 7:50 PM ET
Member Since: 8/18/2005
Posts: 7,977
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Cindy

If you want to see if a pm has been read, click on from me and then click on unread. A check mark will show in the little box next to the pm if the message has not been read

Thanks! I've read how to do it before, I just haven't done it myself, so I keep forgetting.

 

Date Posted: 1/4/2011 7:53 PM ET
Member Since: 8/18/2005
Posts: 7,977
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I don't know if this will work or not, but if she used PBS DC, you can go to the little truck and possibly see if it's traveling anywhere.

The little truck is for entertainment only. If a book is scanned, it should hit those points, but it will continue to 'travel' with no information at all. Used to be when they were new people would watch them drive into an ocean when it traveled faster than the information it received.

The real data is in the scan information.

 

Date Posted: 1/4/2011 8:02 PM ET
Member Since: 9/25/2008
Posts: 4,133
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I mailed a book a few weeks ago and it has yet to be scanned enroute yet. It likely won't get scanned until it is delivered. I'm not worried about it as it will get there at some point.

Date Posted: 1/4/2011 8:11 PM ET
Member Since: 1/17/2009
Posts: 9,958
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Well, I can say that I have personally seen that some books don't get scanned for a long time after you mail them out. I only use DC anyway on multi-book orders, so I am usually awaiting that first scan so that I get my multiple credits .... and I have had some take 10 days or longer to get that first scan. And I had one package (4 books) go about 20 days and only got scanned at delivery. I was a little worried on that one, that I wasn't going to get my credits!

I just don't understand why you think it wasn't mailed out. There would be no advantage to purchasing postage and then not mailing a book out. The only possible way that someone could come to an advantage by doing that would be on an order of more than one book ... I could see a scammer getting an order for 3 or 4 books, buying postage for 3 or 4 credits much more cheaply than for a single book, and then not mailing that package out ..... but the good thing about PBS is that even if there were someone doing this, PBS would catch them pretty quickly because of all the lost books on the receiving end. There would be no way to do it for very long. And, since they are scamming PBS out of the credits, not you and me .... so you can bet that PBS has a great interest in detecting this type of thing very quickly!

Date Posted: 1/4/2011 8:32 PM ET
Member Since: 2/23/2009
Posts: 96
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Just to add to this, I have mailed several items recently from here and swapadvd and the transaction details are not updating on these sites. However, if I plugged the dc info into the usps website, there it actually has scans so details are not updating over here. I have also seen where a lot of enroute scans have been eliminated only had delivery scans so it's entirely possible the sender did actually send it and it's not their fault for it not showing up here. As to the PMS not being responded to, my guess is that they won't until it's closer to the "lost" date, if they still don't respond then the PBS team can/will take action. Maybe they had acct on hold due to holidays and weren't checking in, who knows....



Last Edited on: 1/4/11 8:33 PM ET - Total times edited: 1
Date Posted: 1/4/2011 9:36 PM ET
Member Since: 9/19/2007
Posts: 114
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Right all.  And I have checked the delivery confirmation number to the USPS site, and still no scan.  I really wouldn't care as much except it is a book I REALLY REALLY  want.  Otherwise, I'd simply be sitting and waiting.  I guess we'll see. 

And again, yes there is an advantage.  Say you didn't have any credits, yet there was a wishlist book you REALLY wanted.  You could "pretend" you mailed it out with Delivery Confirmation, you get a credit, and then get your wishlist book.  If your wishlist book is more money than the postage, then you still come out ahead.  But since I see she hasn't seen my PMs, then I don't really think that is the case.  Who knows?  We'll see when it all comes out soon enough.  I have had nothing but good exchanges so I really do not want to think poorly now that I know she is not just ignoring my messages.

Date Posted: 1/4/2011 9:53 PM ET
Member Since: 1/17/2009
Posts: 9,958
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Say you didn't have any credits, yet there was a wishlist book you REALLY wanted.  You could "pretend" you mailed it out with Delivery Confirmation, you get a credit, and then get your wishlist book.

But you can't do this. If you only buy DC, you do not get the credit until the book is scanned at the PO. And, scanned at the PO = mailed.

You have to purchase the full postage online from PBS, plus DC, plus the PBS fee, in order to get the credit when you click "mailed". So, they have already purchased the full postage at that point .... there is NO benefit to not actually mailing the book after you have purchased the full postage. 

Date Posted: 1/4/2011 10:59 PM ET
Member Since: 8/15/2007
Posts: 3,044
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Just to play devil's advocate:

there is NO benefit to not actually mailing the book after you have purchased the full postage.

Couldn't it be assumed that the cost to pretend to mail a book by paying full postage is less than the cost of a credit from the kiosk? I don't know how much it averages since I don't use printable postage, but if the person didn't know about cheap credits in the BB, then they may try a different tactic.

I don't really get why people do it, but I've had two different people pay for DC (at least DC since I guess I can't really see if they paid for postage too) and then never mail the book. One person is still active on the site and the other one doesn't appear to be. Neither ever responded to PMs either. Now if you'd mailed a book and the PO just lost it, wouldn't you respond to a PM about it after the lost date, especially if you were still active on the site? It's weird, but it happens.

Date Posted: 1/5/2011 12:38 AM ET
Member Since: 1/8/2009
Posts: 2,016
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Couldn't it be assumed that the cost to pretend to mail a book by paying full postage is less than the cost of a credit from the kiosk? I don't know how much it averages since I don't use printable postage, but if the person didn't know about cheap credits in the BB, then they may try a different tactic.

From the help docs:

With PBS Printed Postage, you pay 43 cents (includes Instant credit fee paid to PBS plus the fee paid to Endicia, the online postage provider)  from your PBS Money  + 19 cents (to USPS, from your PBS Money) + postage (from your PBS Money) = 62 cents over postage cost

Assuming the book is 1lb or less on media mail:

2.38 + 0.62 = 3.00 which is 0.45 cents less than a kiosk credit at 3.45

(ignoring the fees associated with loading money into your PBS money account)

Not sure if if ~two quarters provides an incentive to game the system in this manner, since it costs ~50 cents to put money into your PBS money account.

ETA: Just found out a kiosk purchase has a 0.50 transaction fee as well. So saving a dollar?



Last Edited on: 1/5/11 12:43 AM ET - Total times edited: 2
Date Posted: 1/5/2011 1:01 AM ET
Member Since: 1/17/2009
Posts: 9,958
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If you take an average media mail book, printing the postage from PBS would cost $2.38, plus $0.19, plus $0.27, so a total of $2.84. (Sophia found the right prices above). So pretending to mail a book would cost you 61 45 cents less than buying a kiosk credit. But it would probaby cost more than buying a credit from the bazaar.

But pretending to mail a book out and actually mailing the book out cost exactly the same. Unless you ran out of packing tape, too, I guess.

That's why I don't think there is any advantage in pretending to mail books out instead of actually mailing them out. Pretending to mail books out is a very short lived scam. I don't need to keep the book in my hand in order to pretend to mail it out. If I am going to pretend to mail a book out, what would stop me from pretending to have it in the first place? I can pretend I have any copy of any book at all (so I would naturally pick the lightest weight WL book that I could find on the site, starting with 64 page children's paperback books, most likely) and then pretend to mail it out, too.



Last Edited on: 1/5/11 1:10 AM ET - Total times edited: 2
Date Posted: 1/5/2011 10:52 AM ET
Member Since: 8/23/2007
Posts: 26,510
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You can buy credtis from other members in the book bazaar for as low as $2.50 or $2.75 so I still don't see anyone doing this on a regular basis to scam a credit out of PBS.  A high number of lost books and PBS DC with no scans would get someone banned from PBS. 

I think you are reading too much into this.  We just went through the busiest mailing season of the year with shorted post office hours due to Holidays as well as some major storms hitting some areas.  (My brother was trapped in NY City where he lives because of storms). 

You'll be back at the top of the line if it goes lost.  Maybe she'll finally answer if the book does go lost. 

Date Posted: 1/5/2011 10:53 AM ET
Member Since: 8/23/2007
Posts: 26,510
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if she has it set to email her when she receives a PM, she could have read it in the email and not responded becuase she feels she didnt' have to if she mailed the book on time.

Date Posted: 1/5/2011 11:38 AM ET
Member Since: 1/3/2009
Posts: 866
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Gina: Just out of curiousity, how long has this person been a member?

Mary L: I agree with your last post. I get email notifications about PMs. You can see in the email what they say (unless maybe they're really long, then I'm not sure). I look at the email and, if it just says something along the lines of "thanks for the book", I just wait and clear the PM next time I stop by PBS. If it's something more, then I go ahead and deal with it.

I didn't know that about checking to see if they read the PM, though. Gonna go check that out. Good tip. :)

Glenda

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