Discussion Forums - Questions about PaperBackSwap Questions about PaperBackSwap

Topic: Odd question about a current trade I am in...

Club rule - Please, if you cannot be courteous and respectful, do not post in this forum.
Page:   Unlock Forum posting with Annual Membership.
Subject: Odd question about a current trade I am in...
Date Posted: 6/27/2011 2:45 AM ET
Member Since: 3/29/2008
Posts: 27
Back To Top

I saw in my account that book was supposed to be mailed on 6/22/11

ok, so on 6/23/2011

I sent a PM asking if they were going to send the book or should I look elsewhere.

I GOT 5 or 6 NASTY PMS back telling me in so many words that she would mail it when she was good and ready!

That she had 2 days grace period from the day that says mail by..Never heard of this one before.

Then it was just rudeness and finally she claimed I took her out of her way that she was not planning on mailing book today (6/23/11)

 

Am I wrong to expect timely mailings??? I always mail my books the same day or next depending on time I get Request.

While I understand things happen, the PM's I got offered no reason why she was going to wait til late minute, just that she was.

The wording in the PM's were insulting to me also, the way she said How Long have you been here you should know about Grace Periods...

It was just uncalled for nastyness I was really upset about them. 

I checked to see if she had a profile to see who she was other then her name....No Profile at all.....yet she claims to have been here since 2006!

I have been here since 2008 and THIS so called Grace Period has NEVER came up or been an issue. 

All the members I have requested books have always mailed before deadline.

The thing that clearly upsets me is I cannot for the life of me understand what she was waiting for,,,,,

If a problem came up and she had to mail late - I would TOTALLY understand things happen.

My question is should I report her and to who? In my honest opinion members like her - are not needed here, 

I am still waiting to see if she ever really sent book by when and if I get it.

I really need advice here, what to do how to handle this - I saved all her PM's in case I needed to show the proof of her 

rudeness and waiting til what last second...she was never even clear on when she was planning on mailing book.

I feel that PBS works because we all mail on time and treat each other with respect and disrespectful people need to go elsewhere. 

 

Date Posted: 6/27/2011 2:55 AM ET
Member Since: 6/4/2007
Posts: 2,941
Back To Top

Hi Samantha, I'm sorry to hear about the awful experience you had. While there is such a grace period in the Help Center Document "Marking a Book Mailed", there's absolutely no excuse for rudeness, and that goes doubly for the unnecessary number of examples you suffered. From the Help Doc mentioned:

"A book must be mailed within 48 hours of marking it mailed

  • It is okay to mark your book mailed before you have mailed it if:

    • The deadline date falls on a postal holiday
    • Your computer/Internet access is unreliable
    • You plan to mail the book on your way out of town
  • It is not okay to mark your book mailed and delay mailing it for longer than 48 hours
    • We understand that sometimes circumstances interfere with prompt mailing!  But this should not be a habit.
    • If your mailing is delayed, you must inform the requestor as soon as possible, so that she doesn't think the book is lost in the mail if it was merely mailed late.
    • To contact the requestor from a book transaction: click or on the transaction, to send a Personal Message."

 

Fortunately, the Help Center also has your back; from the HC Document "How do I contact another member?"

"the Personal message system may not be used for obscene, rude or harassing messages, or sending multiple unsolicited messages to members (this is considered spam).  If you spam by PM and we receive a complaint, you will be warned.  If you repeat the offense after being warned, your membership will be terminated permanently."

 

If you did indeed receive several messages that were rude or offensive, and particularly if you recieved several without continuing the conversation, you should contact PBS directly and let them assess whether any of those messages constitute harassment worthy of their attention. If you've never contacted PBS via the Feedback page, you can find your way their by clicking Contact Us (under the Company heading among the links at the bottom of your screen), and then clicking the Send Us Feedback button on the Contact page. You'll be taken to the Feedback page, from which your message will be sent. If you like, you can simply copy and paste the conversation you had with the Sender right into the message field on the Feedback page.

I hope this problem is resolved for you as quickly as possible, so you can get back to the friendly and peaceful Swap experience you've rightfully come to expect.



Last Edited on: 6/27/11 3:00 AM ET - Total times edited: 1
Subject: Thank You
Date Posted: 6/27/2011 3:53 AM ET
Member Since: 3/29/2008
Posts: 27
Back To Top
I will report her because all her PMs were unwanted and I did not engage in continued conversation. The only answer I wanted was a polite answer to my quest ion about whether she was going to mail or not beyond that they were all really uncalled for. And really the PM's upset me badly! I feel if she treated me this way I cannot imagine how many others she treated so rudely and I feel we he the best site on the entire internet made up of wonder responsible people that do respect not only the rules but each other and I do not want her to treat anyone else here as she treated me! Therefore I don't think I should wait for book to come or not but file report now! Its just so not me to give bad reviews or say bad things about someone and in all the years I have been here this is going to be the first. But I cannot allow this person to get away with her behaviour it wouldn't be fair and I'd feel more guilty if it happened to someone else because I said nothing. Will let you know how it went.
Subject: forgive my typos
Date Posted: 6/27/2011 3:59 AM ET
Member Since: 3/29/2008
Posts: 27
Back To Top
I'm on a blackberry and miss or hit wrong keys. Thanks for allowing me this place to vent and make this big decision.
Date Posted: 6/27/2011 8:06 AM ET
Member Since: 8/10/2005
Posts: 4,599
Back To Top

Everyone has a 2-day grace period after the date they stated they would mail the book. So if she clicked 6/22 as the mail-by date, she would technically have had until 6/24 to mark the book mailed before the system would cancel the request and pass it along to the next person in line. During that time, she would get two E-mail notices from PBS reminding her to mark the book mailed., so she has already received reminders from the site to mail the books--perhaps your PM on top of it just seemed like nagging.

I don't condone her nastiness, but I don't PM people about pending orders for this reason--the system has built-in ways of handling these scenarios, and people do have busy lives. Perhaps she can only get to the post office one day a week so trying to group orders together for that one day can be a hassle. Not everyone can mail a book the same day the order comes in. You can certainly report her for nasty PMs if you like, but she did nothing technically wrong if she was planning to mail on 6/23 instead of 6/22.

I don't think this situation is the same thing addressed by Jimi's post--that would be the 48-hour time after she had *already* marked it mailed, which she had not, if I'm reading your post right.

Cheryl

Date Posted: 6/27/2011 9:31 AM ET
Member Since: 8/23/2007
Posts: 26,510
Back To Top

I would have annoyed with a PM (as the sender) too but there's no call to be rude about it.  I would think a member since 2008 would know that there's a 2 day grace period. It says it on every book transaction.  But the sender should have just let it go or sent 1 PM to say "I'll be mailing on x date". Also unless it was a WL book, the system would just reorder the book for you if she didn't mark it mailed. 

There was no reason for her to send multiple nasty PMs though.

ETA: a profile is not required on PBS and lack of one is no indication that a person isn't active.



Last Edited on: 6/27/11 9:36 AM ET - Total times edited: 3
Date Posted: 6/27/2011 9:34 AM ET
Member Since: 12/10/2009
Posts: 2,472
Back To Top

The sender could have easily marked it mailed to make you feel better and then drive around for 2 days beforeactually  mailing it. She should not be rude in her PMs, but perhaps you should not prompt her w/ a PM. She may have read an unintentional tone in your PM as well.  Personally I can not mark a book mailed until it is mailed (even if I am on my way to the post office) Let the system already in place do its' job

Date Posted: 6/27/2011 9:35 AM ET
Member Since: 10/24/2008
Posts: 1,383
Back To Top

I agree that the sender shouldn't have been rude in the PM's, but we don't know what was in the original PM. Then we need to learn that patience is a virtue here on PBS.

Date Posted: 6/27/2011 10:36 AM ET
Member Since: 2/13/2007
Posts: 2,264
Back To Top

Yup, let the system work and do not PM members to prompt them into mailing...that would annoy me too (as you have now learned, there is a 48 hour grace period beyond the date they have chosen), but rudeness is NEVER called for! Especially if there were 5 or 6 PMs in response to your single PM. If that is indeed the case, I would report here to the team and I would also not PM her again

Patience is required on both sides of a swap!

Date Posted: 6/27/2011 11:36 AM ET
Member Since: 8/16/2007
Posts: 15,186
Back To Top

Whether she was annoyed or not, rudeness is never acceptable. She could have politely told you about the 2 day grace period she has to mark the book mailed. Definitely let the Team know, 5 or 6 nasty PMs are completely uncalled for.

Date Posted: 6/27/2011 12:45 PM ET
Member Since: 12/28/2006
Posts: 14,171
Back To Top

Appears the above comments cover your OP Samantha. 

I also try really hard to mail promptly, but real life happens and once in a great while I also flirt with the mailing deadline.  On rare occasion (say if falls on Sunday), I've marked the book mailed and used the grace period to mail on Monday.   Other members live farther from their post office, travel for work, or have other RL situations to work around.  They can still be great PBS members, and the PBS system is flexible enough that with a little effort (and patience) they can make it work too.

That said, feel free to check the postage or postmark date when your book arrives Samantha.  Counter postage and APC sticker dates are the most accurate.  I've been surprised to received books mailed late with USPS counter postage...not just within the grace period, but a week or two late.  If the book was truly mailed late, you can note that in the box when you log the book in as received.

Date Posted: 6/27/2011 1:22 PM ET
Member Since: 4/28/2009
Posts: 9,576
Back To Top

I can see PMing if you have a true need for the book by a certain date--- Like I have ordered daughter's novels for school here and needed them in less than a month so I just PM'd the senders to let them know there was a timeframe issue for that particular book.  But otherwise a PM before all the days have passed when we're allowed to mail is considered bad form here.

Subject: i reported her
Date Posted: 6/27/2011 2:55 PM ET
Member Since: 3/29/2008
Posts: 27
Back To Top
I sent all the pm' including my one to her. Maybe I unknownly jumped the gun but this 2 day grace period has never since the day I joined been an issue, so I honestly did not know I just believe in prompt. Mailing or a polite pm saying why you cannot which by the way in reviewing rule is a rule in bold. But 5 nasty pms with no explanation was beyond uncalled for, rudeness. Should never be tolerated. So sadly I did report her.
Date Posted: 6/27/2011 5:23 PM ET
Member Since: 5/15/2005
Posts: 1,328
Back To Top

Maybe I unknownly jumped the gun but this 2 day grace period has never since the day I joined been an issue, so I honestly did not know I just believe in prompt. Mailing or a polite pm saying why you cannot which by the way in reviewing rule is a rule in bold.  

It still sounds like you seem to be stuck in your view that the sender mailed the book late. The only 'issue' here is the numerous rude PMs you received. Totally unacceptable. Mailing a day after the date stated does not require a PM. Mailing more than 48 hours after you mark a book mailed does require a PM, (although I've never gotten one). Again, these are two different situations. The rule regarding mailing a book within 2 days of the date stated says:

Your deadline to mark a book mailed appears in red on the transaction for the book on your My Account page

    • The deadline will be 11:00 PM ET, 5 days after the acceptance date if you click "I can mail within two days" when accepting the request
    • The deadline will be 11:00 PM ET, 2 days after the alternate mail-by date you choose if you click "I can mail LATER" when accepting the request

Subject: understood
Date Posted: 6/27/2011 7:30 PM ET
Member Since: 3/29/2008
Posts: 27
Back To Top

BOTTOM LINE: Whether I knew about this Grace Period or Not - Rudeness is never an option.

She could have just as easily explained the Grace Period to me NICELY! 

I never would have thought to ask a simple mailing question to a member here would result in 5 Rude condesending PM'S. If I were late and going past date irregardles of this Grace Period, I would have made

it my business to contact requestor and explain the delay. But that is just me, I grew up always sending Thank You cards, and if I were going to be late to contact person waiting on me, etc...To me its simple 

manners and curtesy.

Am I wrong to expect that from here? A simple I need extra time to send book because _____ would have avoided this entire issue. 

I would have said NO PROBLEM, at all as I have NO issue with that, it's the being left in the dark that confused me and prompted me to send the 1 and only PM.

No I do not respond to rudeness - therefore I did not answer her PM's. I take that back I did answer the last one that said she finallly mailed it with a simple Thank You. 

Date Posted: 6/27/2011 9:42 PM ET
Member Since: 8/23/2007
Posts: 26,510
Back To Top

nevermind.



Last Edited on: 6/27/11 9:45 PM ET - Total times edited: 1
Cathy A. (Cathy) - ,
Date Posted: 6/27/2011 11:32 PM ET
Member Since: 12/27/2005
Posts: 4,124
Back To Top

Am I wrong to expect that from here? A simple I need extra time to send book because _____ would have avoided this entire issue.

Well yes, you are wrong to expect that someone who is sending within the time period allowed by the site should PM you and apologize for following the rules.

I get that you did not understand the deadlines at the time, but those are explained in the Help Center, and they are shown on your My Account page too (hold your mouse over the gray exclamation mark on a pending transaction to see the cancellation date). So it's completely your own fault that you didn't take the time to figure things out before complaining to the other person.

Hopefully you used your manners and courtesy to apologize sincerely for the annoyance that you caused by your ignorance. Consider that if you don't, you're just as bad as the person you're complaining about.

Date Posted: 6/28/2011 8:41 AM ET
Member Since: 11/14/2005
Posts: 1,442
Back To Top

Samantha - the bottom line is that you should be able to expect polite and courteous PM's, regardless of whether or not you should have sent the original PM in the first place.  She was completely wrong to be rude to you.

Date Posted: 6/28/2011 9:06 AM ET
Member Since: 6/4/2007
Posts: 2,941
Back To Top

"Hopefully you used your manners and courtesy to apologize sincerely for the annoyance that you caused by your ignorance. Consider that if you don't, you're just as bad as the person you're complaining about."

Cathy, I'm so sorry, but in my opinion, that sort of comment is completely unnecessary, and the tone is entirely uncalled for as well. Sending a PM that can be perceived as nagging is not even remotely the same as a slew of angry responses. Whether the initial PM was warranted hardly calls into question the entirety of the OPS "manners and courtesy". Not knowing about the grace period is far from blatant ignorance. As others have said, if anyone should have been courteous it's the Sender, who should have politely explained the 48 hour mailing grace period, or at the very least could have not responded at all until the book was mailed. Harassment is not, and never will be an acceptable, appropriate, or equivalent response to what any member perceives to be annoyance.



Last Edited on: 6/28/11 9:09 AM ET - Total times edited: 1
Cathy A. (Cathy) - ,
Date Posted: 6/28/2011 9:46 AM ET
Member Since: 12/27/2005
Posts: 4,124
Back To Top

How do you know the responses were rude? We only have the OP's word for that. I can point you to half a dozen threads where people claimed the other person was rude and then when we actually saw the other person's messages, everybody backtracked.

If you read the OP's original post at the top of the thread, and you look at the style of her writing as well as what she actually said she did, "I sent a PM asking if they were going to send the book or should I look elsewhere." my belief is that Samantha was rude first. That PM, as she herself described it, was confrontational and rude. The responder may or may not have been rude in return, but if she was, I'd certainly weigh that off against Samantha's behavior and give her a pass for at least the same level of discourtesy.

Samantha wants an apology, and she's the one who brought up manners and courtesy while complaining that someone else doesn't have them. I'm just pointing out that Samantha was in the wrong first, so she should be prepared to apologize first.

Of course, you're free to disagree with me and believe every word Samantha has written about the other member. I just tend to take a more jaundiced view of these things based on past experience.

Date Posted: 6/28/2011 1:38 PM ET
Member Since: 6/4/2007
Posts: 2,941
Back To Top

All I see is the introduction of even more rudeness, in a situation that i think we can all agree has already seen quite enough. And while the rudeness between the OP and the Sender involved is limited to PMs, only yours is being aimed at someone directly in the forums. Your past experiences are precisely that: Yours. They don't involve anyone here, and honestly aren't much of a predictor for future interactions with complete strangers. If you feel the need to carry your baggage around with you, that's your business, but it's neither necessary nor helpful to lash out in this forum just because you feel the need to revisit past experiences.

Date Posted: 6/28/2011 6:05 PM ET
Member Since: 12/3/2005
Posts: 3,330
Back To Top

Wow James, you chastise Cathy for being rude then slam her in return.  She is not "lashing out" but simply stating that there is always another side of the story.  And, yes, I also felt that the OP was a bit abrupt in her language stating that she asked in a PM if the person was going to send it whether she should look elsewhere.  There's really no polite way to phrase it as the implication is either the person is lazy by not sending it or defrauding her. 

I'm sorry, but as long as someone is within the guidelines of the site, their actions do NOT require justification.  (The OP seems to feel personally slighted because the book was not mailed on 6/22 and is basically upset that no reason was given.  NO reason was necessary as the sender was still within the allotted time frame.)  The OP in this post continues to go on a tirade about not knowing what the sender was waiting for.  Given the tone of this post, I seriously doubt that the original PM to the sender was all sunshine and roses.

Honestly, had I received a PM, I most likely would have ignored it or cancelled the request for the book altogether if I hadn't already paid for DC or postage.

Samantha, I am very sorry that you felt slighted; however, it's hard to believe that in 3 years you've never had a person mark a book mailed a day or two after the date they originally set.  Life happens.  You have no right to know why an item is delayed unless it is delayed longer than the time specified by PBS and even then, the member just has to notify you of the delay not necessarily why.  In the future, if you need a posted book quickly, you can always ask for it in the bazaar and perhaps someone there can accomodate your time frame; however, ordering from the system directly, you do need to give the sending members the courtesy of allowing them the time allotted to all trades.

Date Posted: 6/28/2011 8:06 PM ET
Member Since: 12/23/2005
Posts: 3,003
Back To Top

Sorry you had a bad experience.  Seems like she got mad at your PM and reacted in anger. Oh well.  Chalk it up to a bad day (for both of you) and move on.

Date Posted: 6/28/2011 10:39 PM ET
Member Since: 7/31/2007
Posts: 2,690
Back To Top

I have to agree with Cathy A and Melissa B.....The tone I perceived when I read what the OP said she said (we only have her word) immediately would have put me on the defensive if I had been the one receiving it.  The sender was well within her rights and time frame, the OP is not owed an explanation of why she is waiting until the last minute.  Her continued posts continue to harp on the concept that she didn't know why the sender was waiting so long, she implies that she is somehow deficient because she is using the time allotted to her.

We do not have both sides of this story...did the sender really send 5 posts, were they indeed rude (we only have the OP opinion and based on what she has posted here brings that into question, IMHO).  Her tone here is rather abrupt and demanding...she expects everyone else to send her her books as quickly as she sends out books requested of her.  You know, life happens, family happens, sometimes people can't just run off to the post office at the drop of a hat and no some people don't use online postage.

yeah, I think Samantha owes the sender an apology first.  Personally, I wouldn't have responded to her PM in the first place, it wasn't a "problem transaction" so, a response would not have been required.

 

Date Posted: 6/28/2011 11:09 PM ET
Member Since: 3/29/2008
Posts: 27
Back To Top
Page: