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Topic: Torn pages.

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Subject: Torn pages.
Date Posted: 7/15/2010 6:57 PM ET
Member Since: 8/5/2009
Posts: 8,012
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I received a book in the mail today, and 3 of the pages are torn (1/4", maybe, and it looks like the pages got caught in something). It's RWAP, right? The packaging looked fine (a bubble envelope with no holes in it).

Last Edited on: 7/17/10 10:52 PM ET - Total times edited: 1
Date Posted: 7/15/2010 9:08 PM ET
Member Since: 7/31/2007
Posts: 2,693
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Yes, it would be a RWAP because the Guidelines state No Torn pages.

Date Posted: 7/15/2010 11:22 PM ET
Member Since: 8/5/2009
Posts: 8,012
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That's what I thought. I RWAP'd and asked for my credit back. *Crosses fingers*

Date Posted: 7/16/2010 9:58 AM ET
Member Since: 12/23/2005
Posts: 3,012
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Accidentally caught/torn pages...only 1/4 inch?  Any words missing?  I don't know; I think this is too tight an interpretation of the rules. 

Date Posted: 7/16/2010 10:57 AM ET
Member Since: 10/6/2005
Posts: 10,718
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It's possible that it got torn inserting it into the bubble mailer and the sender is unaware of the damage. I personally don't think I would mark it RWAP unless the text is damaged.

Date Posted: 7/16/2010 12:38 PM ET
Member Since: 8/31/2008
Posts: 2,608
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If it were me, I wouldn't RWAP for just 1/4" tear.  For a large tear I would RWAP.

edited to correct my dyslexic typing.

Last Edited on: 7/16/10 12:38 PM ET - Total times edited: 1
Lisa N. (LDN) - ,
Date Posted: 7/16/2010 1:08 PM ET
Member Since: 6/19/2007
Posts: 11,148
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I agree, 3 pages 1/4" tear, RWAP is being way too picky.

Date Posted: 7/16/2010 2:39 PM ET
Member Since: 2/13/2007
Posts: 2,272
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I totally agree that 3 pages with 1/4" tear should be acceptable in a used book! I would be furious if someone RWAP me for that. Especially with the cheap paper being used in paperbacks these days. To me that is no different than pages being dog-earred. To me a torn page is one with a 1" tear in it.

And it is obvious immediately why we get into wrangles over postability! What is apparently unacceptable to one, I don't even notice.

Date Posted: 7/16/2010 2:41 PM ET
Member Since: 7/7/2007
Posts: 4,815
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I respectfully disagree with some of the earlier posters.  The condition guidelines here are clear: "No torn pages", period.  Not "no tears of less than x inches", not "no more than x torn pages".   The book with torn pages cannot be reposted.

You should mark the book as RWP, Jennifer, and you are well within your rights to request a credit refund.



Date Posted: 7/16/2010 3:28 PM ET
Member Since: 8/16/2007
Posts: 15,201
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Regardless of our individual feelings, the postability criteria require "no torn pages". There is no degree of acceptable torn pages. If there was, the rules would state the acceptable level just like the cover tear. The criteria should be applied exactly as it is stated because once people start applying their own degree of acceptability, there is no enforceable rule.

Do I believe that a book with 3 maybe 1/4 inch tears should be postable? Yes. But it's not according to the rules as they are stated and that's what we have to go by. If a receiver gets an unpostable book, they have the right to ask for their credit back.

Date Posted: 7/16/2010 4:34 PM ET
Member Since: 2/13/2007
Posts: 2,272
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Of course, she is within her rights to ask for her credit back! But sometimes here in the forums, I feel like we lose sight of the fact that this is a club about reading books, not collecting books. 3 pages with "maybe 1/4" tears" (which says to me that a 1/4" tear might be overstating it) is the sort of thing that even though I do carefully check out books before sending (no, I don't look at every page), I could easily miss. Or as another member stated "It's possible that it got torn inserting it into the bubble mailer and the sender is unaware of the damage."

I don't know -- nitpicking makes me crazy, and if I did get RWAP'd for 3 "maybe 1/4" tears" I wouldn't be happy because I do my best to send out books that meet the guidelines, and I would give the recipient the benefit of the doubt. But jeez...can you feel my frustration!?!?


edited for missing word

Last Edited on: 7/16/10 4:35 PM ET - Total times edited: 1
Date Posted: 7/17/2010 7:07 AM ET
Member Since: 8/10/2005
Posts: 4,601
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As others have said, the rules are clear--no torn pages, so I would mark it RWAP and explain why to the sender. However, I personally would not request my credit back in this instance, although you certainly can if you want. I would just read it and then donate it to my FOL sale or put it on our community bookshelf at work.


Date Posted: 7/17/2010 4:19 PM ET
Member Since: 12/23/2005
Posts: 3,012
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Heck, rules even allow a half inch tear for book covers.

  What is torn anyhow?  A page half ripped out so you can't read it?  Or a possibly 1/4 inch rip that is so tiny as to have no interference with the reading of the book?  I'm sorry, but because the rules are so vague,they are open to interpretation.  I am interpreting them to mean the former.

Date Posted: 7/17/2010 5:56 PM ET
Member Since: 2/13/2007
Posts: 2,272
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I just really think, in my opinion only, that to RWAP because of tiny tears in only three pages (...and what pages are they? ...are they the initial few pages that do not contain any text?) is counterproductive. I share hundreds of books a year, but if I was having to refund credits because of tiny, little flaws that could easily have been there when I bought the book new, that are so insignificant that I don't catch them when leafing through the book prior to mailing, like 3 tiny tears, I would would think long and hard about continuing to swap here and I am sure I would not be the only one. We are here to share books for our reading pleasure.

IMO I think the ability to RWAP should be used for the people who really are sending out bad books -- moldy books, books that have been immersed in water, books with unmentionable stains on them, books with highlighting and underlining, broken spines, etc. (or for those of you with RCs, the people that ignore those.)


Subject: New books with worse tears
Date Posted: 7/18/2010 5:03 AM ET
Member Since: 4/28/2009
Posts: 9,724
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 I have picked up quite a few brand new books--usually hardcovers-- selling for under $10 (many for $4.99)  lately at Walgreen's, Blockbusters, and Walmart.  Several of them have had damage that is not noticeable til you're reading and get to middle of book!  All such flaws making them unpostable. And many of these were WL books released within past year.

Date Posted: 7/18/2010 6:35 AM ET
Member Since: 5/24/2010
Posts: 214
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Jeanne, if they are wL and they are unpostable, there is a thread in the book bazaar for that, you could offer them there.